Saturn, the 6th House, and the Journey Through Grief

Listen here:

Movement Therapist Anne Loyd Willet & Amanda Walsh discuss using astrology as a tool in the journey through grief.

On this episode, you'll learn…

🌕 About the lifelong journey of grief and the chronic pain it brings, offering a compassionate look at how to navigate this complex emotional landscape.

🌗 How astrology, specifically the influence of the Sun in the eighth house, can serve as a guiding light in the grieving process, helping you find wisdom in your own experiences.

🌘 Why confronting the societal fear of death can lead to a deeper understanding of life's bigger wheels in motion.

📚Every day, spiritually-oriented people around the globe turn to Astrology to find Inner Peace & fulfillment, gain a deeper understanding of themselves & others, and navigate the tricky & complex world around them. Join us on the Inner Circle https://astrologyhub.com/ic2023/

Transcript:

[00:00:00] You know, there's, there's books written, you know, it's a year long process. No, it's not. It's a lifelong process. It's not a year long process and it's different for each, every one of us. So it's ongoing, Amanda. It is. I live with chronic pain. I live with chronic pain of having my son died tragically and unexpectedly.

And so I do not think it's ever over, but again, you know, I, I'm pulling back that. That S U N piece, you know, I didn't relate to it when I was younger. I read the little things, didn't get it. And then now I'm like, Oh my gosh, I got that in my eight paths of death. I'm here to navigate through the wisdom within my own experience, brings forward that wisdom to others, their experiences.

And I, I help a transformation of, of movement through life in all ways, not just death and grief, but you [00:01:00] know, our changing bodies. You know, as you and I are speaking in the course of this time, we've had cells in our bodies die, you know, and doctors love to talk about regenerate degeneration, but we've also had a lot of new cells, which is regeneration.

So we're constantly shifting and changing and, and, you know, so I, I've, I've have a, I think I've had a practice in my work of being able to, to do that process, but then when you throw the intensity of it being a child that is yours. That you're dealing with again, I hold on to that S U N and I think I've, I must have signed up for this, but so I must need to do this and step forward, but I also think we, we've got to remember, you know, we live in a codependent world and we, and, and it's, you know, we, we think that we have control over our children, over our partners, over our lives.[00:02:00]

And we have free choice, but we also, we don't have control over any other person and what happens happens.

 

Intro

Anne Willett Grief Gallery-2: Well,

Amanda: hello and welcome to the astrology hub podcast. I'm so happy that you've decided to join us here today for this really important conversation. You know, a lot of people come to astrology during a time of grieving. I know I absolutely did. And I know especially currently we have just recently come through the Maui fires and I'm, I'm literally living in an island.

That is grieving every single person, grieving people, places, and, and really a future that they were counting on, on some level that has now irrevocably changed. So we wanted to come together and do this [00:03:00] episode and who is a movement therapist, a member of our inner circle community, an amazing human being that I've gotten to connect with here on the podcast before.

And has a lot of very specific and tangible uses of astrology to help you through grief. And we're going to hear more about Anne's story and then we're going to get to some tools that you can use to,

to really make the astrology work for you in a way that is helpful, is useful, is soothing, is connecting, um, inspiring even through these really challenging times that we all go through in our experience being humans on this planet.

Before we go into the episode, I just need to thank our sponsor for this episode, Astro Gold. There's a lot of great free astrology softwares out there that can help you get started, but there comes a time in every astrology student's life where you [00:04:00] graduate and you're just ready for the next level of astrological software tools.

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Most of our team here at Astrology Hub and many of the astrologers that you listen to here on the Astrology Hub podcast, such as Gemini Brett, Jamie McGee, Michelle Dench, all of them use Astro Gold and they've integrated them into their practice. The software has earned its reputation as a reliable and insightful tool because it offers high precision calculations for advanced users and beginners alike, all with a very friendly user interface.

The software also provides nuanced interpretations helping you get started with your own readings. It's like

Anne: having a

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Amanda: astrologyhub.

com slash astrogold. Make sure you use the code astrohub15 For your exclusive 15 percent discount, we're going to put that link and the discount code in the show notes of this episode. You won't regret making this commitment to your practice today. All right. So again, today we're talking to movement therapists and member of our inner circle community and will it.

And we're talking about how astrology, how astrology helps her with her grieving journey and how it can help you with your grieving journey. All right. So, and thank you for being here. Thank you for being willing to share your story. Um, I'm so grateful that you're here with us to talk about this really important topic.

How Astrology Helped Anne Navigate Grief

Amanda: And let's just start with your story. What happened in your life that brought you

Anne: to [00:06:00] your

Amanda: understanding of how astrology can help

Anne: you grieve. Well, I think I, I'll back up a little bit and just talk about just a snippet of my, my journey with astrology in general. So I have always had an interest in it since I was very little and used to always read the little snippets in the newspaper, but I could never really.

Connect to my son. I would look at it and look at the little Pisces. I'm a Pisces son. And I go, that doesn't make any sense to me. I'd look at the Taurus snippet, which is my moon. I go, okay, I get that. So I think I was going through life a bit, not, not really understanding it. And then fast forward to 2008.

And that's actually when I had my first reading. So I guess about 15 years ago, and my world just opened up and the astrologer said, Oh, you are connected to astrology and it is connected to you and you get it. And we were, we were speaking to each other. I was asking questions. She, she totally had fun herself because [00:07:00] she was really enjoying.

My understanding of it and I realized from then on that I wanted to study in earnest the the language of astrology which I I think of it as and so it was in 2017 and of course I had looked at I have two boys I like to say one on this side of the veil and one on the other and so it was 2017 and my oldest son passed away unexpectedly and tragically and I had never looked, I looked at his chart, but one doesn't look at your children's charts and say, when are they going to die?

You know, you just don't do that. And I, I, in general, I know some astrologers do look at death, but I think death is the one and only thing. Death of this body is the one and only thing that we are guaranteed is going to happen. And I think if we think that we understand when and or how fully, [00:08:00] then I think we're, we're playing God's work or higher spirits work.

And I think we need to back off of that. Uh, for example, my father passed away after a surgery that he could just never recover from. And we had to unhook him and they said, Oh, it'll be 10 minutes, 20 tops. And it was six hours later. Before he left and I was with him and I saw I thought, you know, he is not going until it's his moment So we don't know when we don't know how but we do know.

Yes, it's going to happen So when my son passed away, I of course I was devastated and there's a lot i'll say on that in a in a moment, but I I realized that He's gone. And so I remembered in his chart that his moon is in Pisces. So I remembered that connection with us. But I thought, and I continue to believe this now when I look at other people's charts, is that he has left.

And [00:09:00] so it's not about looking at his chart to understand. It's about looking at mine. To see what I am here to do. With, with my life, particularly if this was some sort of soul contract. So I realized, I started looking at my chart and I did a couple things. First off, I was so devastated. I looked to my moon sign and thought, how can I, first of all, nourish myself, and I have that Taurus moon, so I, I get regular massages.

So I started getting 'em every week and I got new yummy sheets for myself. Got myself a little bowl of yummy chocolates that I kept filled all these yummy tourist things that I did to nourish myself. And then I looked to my Saturn to say, Oh my gosh, I guess I've got to every day I'd wake up and go, Oh, I'm still here.

I've got to do something. So I looked to my Saturn, which is in my sixth house of work. So I thought, okay, I've got to keep working. But then I also looked to my son, S U N, and had, I guess I had known it on some [00:10:00] level but hadn't really brought it into full perspective that my son is in the 8th house, son, S U N, is in the 8th house of death and transformation, along with Mercury, the lovely messenger of alchemy, um, you know, Hermes is the Greek counterpart, the, they dance between the worlds.

They go deliver the souls to the other side. So I thought, Hmm, you know, there's something there. And I came in on an eclipse. And he left on a solar eclipse in Pisces. So that was fairly profound to me. And his time of death. So these are Mala beads, the Mala beads. There's 108. His time of death was 108. So there was a lot of, um, I'm getting chills.

There was a lot of mystic magic to it that I thought I've got to, I've got to step into this. And [00:11:00] so that's where I really began to realize that the astrology was going to help me. Yeah,

Finding Connection to Pisces Sun in the 8th House

Anne: I

Amanda: find it so interesting that you hadn't really felt that sun moon connection, because you hadn't identified with your Pisces son yet.

And, and that is kind of how astrology speaks to us. It speaks to us in layers and the different parts of our chart reveal themselves to us when we need them, when they could be helpful, when we're ready for them. So tell us more about. What the realization of, wow, I'm a Pisces sun and oh, wow, he, he was a Pisces moon and there's all these mystical occurrences around his death and so how did that further help you

Anne: through, through your process?

Well, I think, you know, I think, I mean, I had, I've identified with my Pisces some my life. I'm [00:12:00] very artistic. I've been an actress and I'm a dancer and I've. than a musician. And I also have come to really understand that Pisces, we Pisces have one foot in this world and one foot in the other.

And sometimes we get a bad rap for being highly emotional, but I think it's just that we're very tuned in. Um, and fortunately I have this Taurus moon, which has kept me grounded. But I think what it did for me is I thought I've got to really look at my son, S U N, to see what I'm here to manifest in this eighth house of death.

And right off the bat, I will say I was, I was never going to kill myself, but when you lose a child, you don't, you don't want to be alive truly. I mean, there, I shouldn't say that for everybody. Cause we're all so it's so unique. for everybody, but it's so grief is so incredibly devastating and so incredibly painful.

And yet so incredibly transformative, which is that son in the eighth house that I realized I [00:13:00] didn't want to be here. And so, but I had to, so I had to look to that S U N around my S O N and, and dig deeper. And one of the things. Well, there were several things that came out. One was, is, you know, people, it's part of the human condition.

They, I don't want to use the word like, but they're okay with seeing you as a victim. And I'm not a victim. I'm not, I don't, I don't have that type of mentality. For some people, being a victim serves them in some sort of way because it gives them the attention they need, or it gives them a place to work from.

But people, I found that, that saying that I want to unpack, so sorry for your loss. What is just wrong. And I say that boldly. So if you break it down, I began to hear that if you break it down to first of all, the I am statement, which are powerful and I use those in my work for myself, my own practice and my work, [00:14:00] you know, the I am statements.

I am enough. I am beautiful. I am powerful, you know, bringing that type of energy into to being grounded and rooted in who we are as a human being showing up. So when we say I am sorry. That has kind of a, uh, feeling to it. I am sorry. I am sorry. Now, when we do something wrong, we can say, I apologize. You know, I apologize, but I am, I am power of I am, and I am sorry, doesn't have a good ring to it.

Then when you add for your, I am so sorry for your, it's essentially like I am so sorry for your life. You know, I am so sorry for this event that is part of your journey. You know, I am so sorry for whatever and it's like, wait a minute. This is, this is my, this is my life. This is my path. And we all have these, we all have stuff that happens in our life that brings us to a very sad place or brings us to some sort of grief, and it's part [00:15:00] of our journey in the course of the astrology can help us navigate around that.

But I am so sorry for your life doesn't ring and then when you say I'm so sorry for your loss. That a person is not ours to begin with, and we don't lose them.

There, there is a shift that happens when someone dies. There's a shift. There's a shift when someone is born. And I began to really see that, the interconnectedness of us, so that he left, and there was this shift in me.

Uh, there was a shift in anyone that knew him. And it's not a loss because he wasn't mine to begin with, no one is ours. It's that, it's that, you know, having, practicing non attachment at its best when you, when you tease through that statement. So that was one of the first things I recognized and I thought I have such [00:16:00] a strong feeling about this that I really think I'm here to bring forward with that son in the eighth house, the S.

U. N. in the eighth house, to bring forward a lot Of wisdom around grief and death and and death both figuratively as well as transformationally, so when I was when I went off to college, I went up to the northeast and I was on an adventure. I was going to dance or I want to go to a graduate school up there and my parents were very hesitant, but they supported me in my little free spirit.

So everything to my name that I had a whole room full of furniture, bad chest of drawers, all my treasures, all my photographs, all of my jewelry, everything that I had to my name at that uh, Point was in a biggest U Haul you could get filled with their big old station wagon, all my stuff. We did a 20 minute stop in Boston to get some coffee, came out 20 minutes later [00:17:00] and it was gone.

The car was hot wired, it was found completely stripped and the U Haul completely empty. And so I had to go and buy a toothbrush and a pair of underwear. And I remember that I was in my young 20s starting out on an adventure. So that was a type of grief. And even though it wasn't a death. It was a type of grief of loss and of a life no longer, you know, that was not going to be I was so I was a bit naive and and realized that it was not going to be I did end up staying up in the Northeast, but it was not going to be quite as magical as I had anticipated.

And it also woke me up to just understand that, you know, when we lose things when we lose. When we lose, I don't want to be saying that when things go away, they don't get lost, they shift, they get stolen, they burn down. Um, you know, that is a [00:18:00] part of our life that is, is transformative. And so it can take us out and it does some people.

Again, that's probably part of their fate, their journey, but it can also take us to a place we've never been before. A huge shift. So I brought that 17, that was 2017. 2020 20 is when I actually brought astrology into my, my work as a separate, it's not my main brand, but I bring it in as a service. It's called Moving the Body through Astrology, and I was.

Talking to people about like all of the energies that were in Capricorn, you know, I was using words that they didn't necessarily know where we're astrology, but I was saying, you know, all the systems are being broken down and you'll see a familiarity with that. And then in 2021 with the Uranus Saturn square, I'd say, you know, it's, it's about deciding whether you want to try to hold on to that, which is familiar and not sustainable, but is yummy simply because it's.

Familiar or go to [00:19:00] some place that is unknown and really where you're being called to go, whether collectively within the structure or individually within the structure of our body. Because, um, we talk about Capricorn being the bones. Well, for me, Capricorn is a fascia because that's the organ of form. So I began to bring it in to my work.

And I, and again, would that have happened without this shift? I don't know. We can't go back and, you know, into the crystal ball,

but I do believe that his passing created this huge shift within me, which brought me into, to many different places that I never would have imagined I would And I think that's what happens in grief.

If we can, if we can honor ourselves, and I go to the moon for that, if we can just keep showing up, and I go to the Saturn for that, and if we can recognize that it's part of our journey. And allow ourselves to cry, to scream, to [00:20:00] do whatever we need to do, and to not become a victim of the, I'm so sorry for your loss, but to recognize that it truly is a part of one's life.

It, it sheds a little light on it. It doesn't take away the pain, but it does shed some light on that there is, there is a meaningful, there is a divine process to all of this.

Anne's Perspective on Grief and Her Own Grieving Process

Amanda: A mother of two children. I would say whenever I hear spiritual teachers or, or, you know, religious philosophies speaking about non attachment, it's the one thing that I'm like, I could let go of all of it.

But that one is just, and to hear you speak about how you moved through it and you're just completely. Like [00:21:00] why is an elevated perspective around it. I'm so curious about your process of how you got there. I also want to know if so sorry for your I'm so sorry for your loss completely resonate with everything you're saying, let us know, maybe we'll get there at the end, what's a better alternative, you know, because It's just sort of like a cultural thing.

It's kind of like, Hey, how are you? You know, it's, it's kind of like the thing that people say, and they probably don't even think about what they're saying and they don't know what else to say. So I would love to hear what you would, what you would have preferred or what you still would prefer to hear instead of that, but how did you get there?

You know, from, from a place of like, Not even wanting to be here on the planet anymore, which I can completely understand

Anne: to knowing that

Amanda: you needed to be here. For probably your other child and for, you know, other things in your life, um, to this place where you're now helping other people with grief [00:22:00] and, you know, you've, you've been transformed by this process.

What did that look like?

Anne: Well, I have to say it's, it's ongoing. It's ongoing. It doesn't end. You know, there's, there's books written, know, it's a year long process. No, it's not. It's a lifelong process. It's not a year long process. And it's different for each and every one of us. I tried going to one of those groups with parents of and it was like, Oh, get me out of here.

I have nothing in common with these people. I'm coming at it from a different place because I'm a different person. So it's ongoing. Amanda. It is. I live with chronic pain. I live with chronic pain of having my son. And so I do not think it's ever over, but again, you know, I, I'm pulling back that, that S. U.

N. piece, you know, I didn't relate to it when I was younger. I [00:23:00] read the little things, didn't get it. And then now I'm like, Oh my gosh, I got that in my eighth house of death. I'm here to navigate through the wisdom within my own experience to bring forward that wisdom to others and their experiences. And I, I help in transformation of.

of movement through life in all ways, not just death and grief, but, you know, are changing bodies, you know, as you and I are speaking in the course of this time, we've had cells in our bodies die, you know, and doctors love to talk about regenerate degeneration, but we've also had a lot of new cells, which is regeneration.

So we're constantly shifting and changing. And, you know, so I, I've, I've have a, you know, I think I've had a practice in my work of being able to do that process, but then when you throw the intensity of it being a child that is yours, that you're dealing with, again, I hold on to that S. U. N. And I think I've, I must have signed [00:24:00] up for this.

So I must need to do this and step forward. But I also think We've got to remember, you know, we live in a codependent world, and we've, and it's, you know, we think that we have control over our children, over our partners, over our lives, and we have free choice, but we also, we don't have control over any other person, and what happens, happens.

And how they come and when they go and going back to what I said earlier, the one certain thing in this lifetime is that we are going to die and those that we love are going to die. We might go before them. They might go before us. We don't know when we don't know how. So we live with that. And if we can hold that in the space.

Without fear, and this was a lot of what I did during 2020. So many people are so afraid of dying. And I'm like, but your life doesn't look that great to begin with. Whatcha holding onto, you know, [00:25:00] so, but they're holding on because it's like this fear of death. And for me it's, it's. You know, it's just something that we have to live with as humans, that we are going to die out of this body and we dunno how it all works.

You know, we religions have, we have constructs and religions that, you know, can guess, but there's always the unlimited and there's always the unknown. And so we don't know, especially when it comes to death. So it's more about, hmm, just waking up to bigger wheels in motion. For me, I just have to trust. And surrender to the bigger wheels in motion and know that this is part of my plan and, and trust in that.

But I do live with chronic pain, so I'm navigating through it anyway. And so I don't want to get stuck in the trauma or stuck in something. And again, that's the work I do. I've got to move it through me. I have to do a lot of breathing [00:26:00] and I spend a lot of time alone. Um, but I don't. You know, I have to, I have to trust that this, this is just part of it.

And it does take a lot of, um, a lot of practice and you bring up a good point, Amanda, when you say, you know, cause you're, you immediately think of your personal story because you are a mother's a mother. And we share that. We share that understanding of what it's like to be a mother, but this is my life and not yours.

And so when something happens to someone else, whether it's a death. or tragedy, or even what's going on in what you're experiencing in Hawaii right now, we're looking from the outside. And we can project our own stories on that, but in the end, it's, it's the person's own life. And so, that's that, that's where I get into that, so sorry for your, you know, it's like, back off!

This is my life, you know, this is what I'm here to do, and I've got to navigate through it. [00:27:00] And so we… I, I found myself consoling people because they would be so upset. I'm divorced and I was consoling my former husband. I was consoling people because they're inserting their story on, on my story. And so it's painful and it's tragic, but it's still mine that I have to navigate through.

It's not theirs. So part of what you're saying, you know, is, is a really good point is that we do tend to. When we look at someone else's tragedy, we put our own story on it as if it were ours. And it's not. We have our own tragedies and own traumas and own things to deal with. And I might look at something that happened to you and go, Oh my gosh, how on earth are you possibly dealing with it?

And you'd be like, I'm okay, I'm doing it, you know? So it's that kind of back and forth of when we When we're really not in someone else's shoes because we can't be nor should we be.

Significance of Sun, Moon & Saturn

Amanda: Yeah, and for people who aren't as [00:28:00] familiar with a Astrology or their chart or how to read their chart from what I've heard from you It's like a pretty basic understanding and interpretation of your Sun your moon and your Saturn that you really fell back on like oh Sun and Pisces in the eighth house.

Okay, death and transformation and, and, you know, being able to help others with that. Like, and then you said about your Taurus moon, I mean, just straight up yummy things. Okay. Get some new sheets and get the massage and eat the chocolate and take care of yourself in that sensual way that the Taurus moon loves.

And then the Saturn in the sixth house, it's like, Oh, I need to show up and do my work. So it, I love what you're bringing in here because it's not like, Oh, you knew this was aspecting this and this was at this degree. And this was, you know, it was just basic, like, you know, anybody could look, could get a free chart run

Anne: or a kid [00:29:00] Astro

Amanda: gold and get your, you know, if you want that point, but, you know, get, get a free chart run and look, okay, my son is in this sign in this house.

What does that mean? My moon is in this sign, and you didn't even look at the house for the moon, but just my moon is in this sign. My Saturn's in this house. Okay, this is where I can place my focus, and where I can, I can funnel my energy through. quite simple. Yeah, and in so doing, I'm on my path, which is unique to me, and yes, I'm gonna still be in pain about this, and this isn't gonna erase it, but at least I know I'm on my path, and I'm living my path.

Exactly. It means I can't. It's, it's that

Anne: simple. Yeah, it is. It is. I mean, we can get as complicated and as wild as we want with it and it can get fun. Um, but that's actually how I bring it into my work. I bring it in in a very simple way [00:30:00] because I, it's just like we can get lost. In, in all of that, we can get lost in anything that goes beyond, beyond, beyond.

But, and then there's people that crave it more. There's something for everybody. But it really can be so simple. It's a language. It's a tool. It's a calendar. You know, it's not a crystal ball, but it's got a wonderful set of tools that we can use. So very simple. Yeah.

The Chronic Pain of Grief

Anne: When you say you live with

Amanda: chronic pain, are you talking about the grief?

Or are you talking about actually

Anne: in your body? No grief, grief. I know how to. Yeah. So I have when I, when things manifest in my body, I know how to breathe and move them through because that's the work I do. And I do have that occasionally, you know, um, I had, yeah, I had some chronic pain, um, in my low belly.

And I know that that was totally tied to, you know, to my womb. And so, but I have to move through that. So I do, but no, when I say pain, I mean, oh, just sadness. I will, um, [00:31:00] where I live, there's this lovely place where they have all these statue, these concrete statues and fountains with water and they go off and the kids go and play in them when it gets hot.

And I remember my son used to, Jackson used to play in those And just

Start crying to myself by myself, five years later, you know, so, and I, I imagine that's going to continue. And I've been with people and they'll talk about someone who has passed they'll speak to them as if it were yesterday, and it may have been many, many, many years. I have a client who passed away on New Year's Day.

She was 101 and she was lovely and she moved better than some of my younger clients. But she would talk about her, her love, her husband who had passed away before her. And she'd get tears in her eyes. Every time. And he had died 40 years, 50 years ahead of her. [00:32:00] So, I look at that and learn and think, Mmm, I'm probably going to, that's what I mean by pain.

And that's the best way to describe it. Is, is the, it's a sinking feeling. It's a heaviness. It's a pain. Um, I've actually written a book on pain, called Pain is One Dance Partner. And I bring forth a lot around that subject of pain. So pain can be, can be psychological, mental, physical, you know, it can manifest in different ways.

So, yeah.

Capacity for Experiencing Higher Emotions

Amanda: Also, like, do you experience joy? Can you experience, like, the opposite of that emotion? And I know it's been said. That the deeper we go in some of the less comfortable emotions like pain and grief and sorrow, the more capacity we have for things like joy. Do you agree [00:33:00] with that? And has that been your experience?

I'd love to hear you speak to that.

Anne: I love that. And that's an excellent question, Amanda. It really is. I've had to, to seek it. It was hard at first. It was very hard at first. And I definitely have to, you know, I find myself talking to my clients about balance, you know, pain with pleasure, grief with joy.

And then I'm like, and you got to listen to what you're saying to other people. So I do have to seek it. It does take effort, but I believe. Like anything, even the pain of grief or even the pain of physical, physical pain that people feel it can be what they call chronic, but I know in talking to people that there are moments when it doesn't hurt.

So I think everything is fleeting. I think happiness is fleeting. I think joy is fleeting. I think pain is So if we think about this very, these very dynamic emotions that are coming and going, Okay. It's more about recognizing when it's here and grabbing [00:34:00] it. So I made a, I told my client one time, I said, notice when you laugh and say aloud, I am laughing.

And as I was telling her that, I thought I need to do that myself. So I started doing that. And I would, I would start laughing at like silly thing. I go, Oh my God. And I have this sort of goofy laugh and I went, Oh my gosh, and you're laughing. And I'd say that loud. And then I, then it would make me smile.

And then I would feel that joy. So I had to really, again, like a practice or anything I had to make. Recognizing the joy of practice. I think, you know, joy can be there, comes and goes, just like happiness comes and goes, just like pain comes and goes, but I had to make a concerted effort to identify it. And I did it by saying it out loud.

Oh, I'm laughing. I'm feeling good. Yeah.

Amanda: So good. Yes. Yes.

Feeling the Presence of her Son

Amanda: Do you feel Jackson? Like, do you feel like you can talk to him or, or be with him in any way? Or for you, was it [00:35:00] sort of like a real. Ending of his presence in your life in this

Anne: dimension. No, he's, he's, no, he's, he's still here. And again, I think it's that moon sun connection.

But I also think it's a part of just who I am. With my sun and my mercury and all these things in my eighth house, I think I'm really connected to those that I connect with. I don't just do things lightly. I really, I would say I don't have a huge circle, but my circle is pretty. Profound of my tribe.

And so he is definitely here. He came to he's he came to me. He came to me in my dreams for a while, and he hasn't in a long time. I think he came in. And again, it was, um, I think it was right when Saturn went into Pisces. He came to my dream again. And but I hadn't had yet. I hadn't. He hadn't been in my dreams for about four, maybe a little over four years right after he had passed away close to five.

So he's come to my dreams. [00:36:00] He's given me messages. Yes. There have been interesting things that have happened, um, when I was typing the book, my computer kept stopping, and I, I felt like it was him, you know. It was, uh, there were, one time I, I went out and I just was feeling very distraught and I said, you know, oh gosh, I just wish I knew where you were.

We have these amazing storms here, where I live, beautiful storms and beautiful rainbows. And boom, there was this double rainbow that just appeared. So there's been a lot of lovely messages. And I think, you know, it's not woo woo. It's just, I was saying earlier, you know, if you allow time for the serendipity, the divine finds you.

And so these, these messages are, are real to me. And I do feel he's still here. And I think, you know, still again, it's different for different people, but I think that's part of the, you know, so sorry for your loss. He wasn't mine to begin with. [00:37:00] And he's somewhere else. I don't know where, but I still very much feel his presence and very much feel his love.

And I very much feel my love for him. And love is very powerful. So that keeps, that keeps him here, but not here. You know, just, just present to my, to my, where I am.

Amanda: My love doesn't even use the word death. He, he just, he's like, it's. It's graduation. It's just, you're moving to another dimension. There's no, like that, that word death and, and like all the heaviness that comes with it for us.

It is a, it's a statement of like finality. Like it's, and of course there are aspects that are final. You're not in the body anymore.

Anne: I think that's, I think that's the death. Yeah. As a body as a body worker, it's that the body has has has died. That's the, but not the soul, not the spirit.

Amanda: Yeah. Yeah. And there's something about that word I think that we use in our [00:38:00] culture that it also, it like almost compounds the, the, um, experience, you know, because even, uh, I, I got the pleasure of working with a Hawaiian kahuna and she would always say they changed

Anne: address.

Oh, I love that. That's great. It's something so, like,

Amanda: comforting, just about, like, then just change address. You know, there's, there's a lightness to it that the word death, it's like the antithesis of the word death with just like, boom, you know, but, and then also it's just, everybody's out where they're at, you know?

And, and, and, and if that's what it feels like for you, then that's what it feels like for you where you're at. So there's nothing wrong with that either. You know?

Yeah. Um,

Anne's Offering to Others

Amanda: and if there's people out there, you know, that are grieving the graduation of a child, the, um, you know, the ending of a, of a dream. I love how you say, [00:39:00] um,

Anne: the, a life no longer the ending of a life.

No longer a life that's no longer ending of a

Amanda: life no longer. I mean, every single one of us can relate with that on some level, right? Yes. Well, like if this person's listening, what, what do you want to say to them right now? If they're in the thick of it, you know, they're in the, the, the, the real intense moment set of that

Anne: experience.

Yeah. Well hold sacred space for it. Hold sacred space, which means allowing yourself the time that you need doing again, you know, doing what nourishes you to keep going, but also recognizing that it. It's a moment in time. And so what's in this moment in time right now is I say that all the time when I'm with my clients.

All we've got is this moment. You know, if that's all we've got, and so if we want to feel sad, if we want to stick our head in the sand, if we want to cry, want to yell, do it, [00:40:00] do whatever you want to do. Just be sure you nourish yourself and be sure that you hold a sacred space because this is when you're going through any sort of trauma, tragedy, grief, period of loss.

Again, I don't want to use that word. See, I'm so programmed myself of shifting. I change it to shifting. When you're going through a period of shifting, it's important that you recognize That it's, it's part of something bigger that you don't understand and you will perhaps later understand. Yeah, I mean, it's, it's also important, Amanda, is that there, it's so individual, you know, and so this will probably bring in what we were saying, you know, don't say so sorry for your loss.

We don't know what to say to people because we don't know how they're feeling. And then we think just the human condition, Oh, am I going to say [00:41:00] something wrong? Am I going to say the wrong thing? Am I going to, you know, and that's just all part of that humanness. But if we focus on the fact that we're each individual here showing up as who we are, and if we're grounded and connected to ourself, and astrology really helps us get to know who we are, it gives us a little bit of a insight into our, our blueprint, our map.

Then sometimes you just, you might say, I have no words, you know, I have no words, or I oftentimes go, if it's appropriate, I will hold, I will hold their hand and just Or I have no words or I'm with you. I'm here. Just just I'm in that moment in time. Whatever's coming out for me as as in in that moment in time.

So it would be like for you because you you're so beautiful and so authentic and who you are. And it would just be just I'm going to be Amanda this moment in time and say what's what's on my [00:42:00] tongue. But they do, we do, they do like to be remembered, you know, we, we say, if you go to a funeral, so sorry for loss, so sorry for loss, you'll hear that down the line.

And it's like, and then they tick it off their list, they're gone and you're left alone with your life. I love when people, and I have this wonderful dear friend in Virginia, and she always sent me a little note on his birthday. She sends me a little text on the day that, that he passed. And that is like, Amazing.

You know, so if it's someone that you care about, make note of the of the day that they passed, make note of their birthday. That's a new picture. If it's someone you truly send them a little note, give them a little card. But in that moment in time, when you're going through the receiving line, speak from your heart in that moment in time from your own authentic sense of who you are, your own being.[00:43:00]

That's powerful.

Amanda: That's where it's at.

Is it nice to hear things that people love about him? Yes! And, or, or to have questions, like, for when people ask you, you tell me a story about him, or what, you know, like.

Anne: Yes, and that's, that's a great question, Andy, because people don't, they're afraid to talk about it.

I went to Thanksgiving right after, a few months after he died in June. I went to Thanksgiving at my brother's. And it was like the elephant in the room that nobody wanted to talk about. And I was like, well, you know, Jackson would have loved da da da da da da da. And they all went, you know, they didn't know what to say.

And I went, Jackson would be okay with it. You know, I had to provide comfort for them, but I wanted to keep him in the, in the conversation. I wanted to keep him alive, but people, they took off that. So sorry for your, for your loss. And then they stopped talking to you about it, you know, unless they're very good friends or close to him.

Yeah.

Amanda: I mean, thank you for that. Like, we just, [00:44:00] we don't get a whole lot of, of information I guess about, or not information, but it's not modeled a lot in our culture. Like, how do you do this? Like, how do we help each other in the best way through it? But I love that we've gotten to hear a lot of very tangible things that not only can help people who are experiencing grief themselves.

But also those of us who are comforting others. Who are experiencing grief, how astrology can very simply and powerfully both anchor you and what is your unique path in this, in this experience, but then also just anchoring you in that bigger perspective, which I know for myself is so helpful. It's like, here are the things that are happening in our day to day reality.

And here's a bigger vantage point for potentially why. And, you know, it's not always clear in the moment. Sometimes it's the. You know, the gift of [00:45:00] time that enables that perspective, but still there, the, even just the knowing that there is a bigger storyline unfolding of which we're a part of, you know, we're a part of that story.

We're in that story and we experienced everything with that story and they're the bigger, something bigger is happening.

Closing

Amanda: So you are just so beautiful and wonderful. And I would so love to be in one of your movement therapy. Or experiences. And I'm sure there's many who feel the same. We're going to put links to a lot of the things that Ann talked about here today in the show notes.

Amanda: We'll also put links to how you can run a free chart. If you are out there and you're going, God, I don't really know. I don't know what my moon size sign is. I don't know what house it's in. I don't know what my Saturn is. I don't really know what that means. You can start with actually, we do have a free sun, moon and rising report, which

Anne: would really be a great

Amanda: starting point.

Yeah. I know that. [00:46:00] I know that link off the top of my head,

Amanda: astrology. com slash S M R S S and sun moon

Anne: Amazon moon are, which is your sun and rising. You're,

Amanda: you'll get a lot of information just from there. And you can apply that to the grieving process. And you can, if there's someone in your life, Who's grieving something or someone you could get their sun, moon and rising and, and really, you know, if you know what their moon is nourish them that way.

Like I'm sure and people that knew that you, you know, you love yummy things. They were able to provide those things for you too. So we can do these things for each other. We can do these things for ourselves. Um, Anne, you're just a beautiful person. I'm so grateful that you're in our inner circle where I've gotten to know you more and I've gotten to, you know, know you through time.

Go

Anne: ahead, Anne. Yes. I was just going to say, plug for inner circle. So after my son passed away, it was, uh, I can't remember what year it was, but I joined the inner circle and that just [00:47:00] continued to feed me more and more and more and more. So that was a beautiful, um, life, lifeline to this whole story as well, was having access to that service.

So

Amanda: well, if you, we'll put the link for that. Yeah.

Amanda: We'll put the link for the inner circle our, our monthly membership program in the show notes as well. And Anne, just thank you. Just thank you for being willing to share such a vulnerable and intimate and real and raw, um, aspect of yourself with us, because you, the, the, the perspective that you bring is really, it's empowering.

It is. And it's, it's really, um, it's inspiring. So thank you for that. And, um, you're just a beautiful light keep shining. And I hope that I get to be with you in person someday. And yeah, me too. All right, everybody. Thank you so much for tuning in. You know, thank you for being in our community. Thank you for, for exploring how astrology can help you in your life in so many different ways.

[00:48:00] And I hope that it. Serves as a tool for you. And if not, there's many tools, but this is one that's been really, really powerful for us. So it's always a joy just to share it with you. And hopefully it's connected with you on some level. Thank you as always for making astrology a part of your life. And we'll look forward to connecting with you on the next Take care,

Anne: everybody.