The 8th House: The House of Death, Anxiety and…Other People’s Money? w/ Ryhan Butler
The Eighth House Explained by Medieval Astrologer Ryhan Butler
In this episode of the Astrology Hub Podcast, Amanda ‘Pua’ Walsh and Astrologer Ryhan Butler talk about what the 8th House represents in Astrology and how to use it when interpreting a birth chart.
You’ll learn …
On Today’s Episode You’ll learn…
🌑 Why the 8th House is considered a “dark house” and which other houses are considered “dark.”
🌒 Whether having a lot of planets in the 8th House means you will experience more hardship in your life.
🌓 How to prepare yourself for a significant 8th House transit.
5:15 What does the 8th House Represent
9:40 Planets in the 8th House
11:26 Malefic v Benefic Planets in the 8th House
13:26 Death, Fear, Anxiety & Other People’s Money
16:44 Predicting Death
19:05 Transits in the 8th House
24:13 Relationship to Money
26:02 Positive Aspects of the 8th House
30:54 What is the Occult
33:13 Beyond the Veil Experiences
35:53 No Planets in the 8th House
37:02 Navigation Tools for 8th House Transits
42:15 Ryhan’s Favourite House
42:50 Ryhan’s Mastery Class
Just head to ASTROLOGYHUB.com/outlook
[00:00:00] Rhyan Butler: I have seen a lot of people who have like strong eighth house placements, be able to be you know, like crisis counselors emergency room doctors, people who can be there to get people through. And I would say that that is a really powerfully helpful, powerfully positive manifestation of the eighth house.
[00:00:23] This podcast episode is brought to you by the Inner Circle, your place to learn astrology and community with the masters and transform your life in the process.
[00:00:34] Amanda Walsh: Well, hello everybody and welcome to the Astrology Hub Podcast. This is a continuation of our House series, and today we are here for a deep dive into the eighth house. I’m here with astrologer and upcoming Inner Circle astrologer guide. Ryan Butler, who will be helping us understand all things eighth house and in case you’re hopping into the middle of this series.
[00:00:58] The House series here at the Astrology Hub Podcast is dedicated to helping you understand all 12 of the houses, what they mean. What they represent in your life, how to interpret different planetary placements in the houses. And each week we’re releasing a new episode focused on one of the houses taught by one of our inner circle astrologer guides and mentors.
[00:01:21] And we’ve gathered the most commonly asked questions about each of the houses, and we’re just going deep . So if you have been hanging out here with us during this series, thank you so much for joining us. I have loved hearing your feedback and I’m so happy that you’re enjoying the series as much as I am and as much as we are at Astrology Hub.
[00:01:40] So I’m gonna tell you a little bit about Ryan before we dive in. Ryan has studied classical astrological techniques with an emphasis on medieval astrology since 2009. He has lectured locally and is a part of national conferences working to spread the techniques of astrology, so those who would otherwise not encounter them or may not immediately see their value.
[00:02:03] Ryan, thanks
[00:02:03] Rhyan Butler: for joining us. Yeah, thanks so much for having me.
[00:02:05] Super excited to, to dive into this. I would say probably one of the more interesting and more maybe fun houses for people. So, awesome. This is gonna be exciting to see kind of what questions or , or what we’re able to, to help dispel for people as we approach this, this particular house.
[00:02:23] Amanda Walsh: Perfect. And you know, we’ve, we’ve had a few questions from the audience so far about house systems mm-hmm. and what they mean and what they are. We are gonna be doing a 13th episode. This is just getting, yeah. The 13th episode is going to be with Gemini Brett on the house system. So we’re gonna be going deep dive when to use one versus the other.
[00:02:45] What are the differences, the nuances, and I’m assuming since you’re a medieval astrologer that you’re using whole sign.
[00:02:50] Rhyan Butler: No. Is that, No. Ooh, no. I, Kurt, am. Yeah. Yeah. CarVal. No, I am I, I, I playfully describe myself as a whole signed skeptic. Some controversy there. I primarily utilized Plaus houses but I have I’ve, I’ve, throughout my, you know, since 2009, I’ve used probably about four different house systems before, just kind of being like, you know what?
[00:03:12] Plastics, that’s the best. That’s, that’s my favorite. Okay.
[00:03:16] Amanda Walsh: You know what? And I just wanna say to any of you new who are like, there’s all these house systems and there’s all these things to learn. It’s so overwhelming. Just what I’ve heard from most astrologers is just choose one. Mm-hmm. to learn with.
[00:03:27] Just go with the one that you’re working with right now and then you will have time to explore the other ones. Yeah. And then nuances and the when and the why and the how. Just stick with one for now and, and. don’t, don’t allow yourself to get too confused by all the different nuances. Right? Yeah. Yeah.
[00:03:43] Would you say that
[00:03:44] Rhyan Butler: to Ryan? Yeah, absolutely. Because it’s one of those things where it’s like, people or students will eventually come and they’ll be like which house system should I use? Right. And to me, that’s kind of just be like, well, what breakfast cereal do you want? Like, what are you after in a house system?
[00:03:56] Yeah. And so like that question. Is such a weird question to be asked. It’s like, well, what are the houses to you? Like, let’s just start there. And you know, if that doesn’t, if that’s a question that sounds like gibberish to you, then that’s fine. You know, we can come back to that later. But yeah, just pick one thing, get comfortable with it, and then you can always circle back around to figuring out what, what fits your style the best.
[00:04:17] Later on. I
[00:04:19] Amanda Walsh: remember when I first came into astrology, it felt a little bit like the diet debate. Like, should you be keto? Should you be paleo? Should you do low calories? Should you do low fat? It’s, it was so overwhelming to hear all the different opinions. So I love what you’re saying, Ryan, and totally concur.
[00:04:35] Just pick one for now. Go with it. And the thing about learning astrology is that more and more gets revealed to you. As you’re ready and as you know, as you’re gonna be able to absorb it. So just, I, I continually remind people, just relax and yeah, enjoy
[00:04:50] Rhyan Butler: the process of learning. Yeah, I think relax is a good thing to say because ultimately whatever house system you use really isn’t that important.
[00:04:57] So like , it’s not that serious. Yeah. But people good, but people make it to that way. So I see where a lot of the, I see where the stress comes from, but it’s like, it’s not that. It’s fine. . Okay. You haven’t, you haven’t, you haven’t ruined it. You haven’t shot yourself in the foot Fri by using whatever house system.
[00:05:14] It’s . Fine. Don’t worry about it. .
5:02 What Does the 8th House Represent?
[00:05:15] Amanda Walsh: Okay. Perfect. All right, so with all of that said, , let’s talk about the eighth house. What does it mean? What does it represent? Just give us that like high, high level overview of
[00:05:25] Rhyan Butler: the eighth. Okay, so, the eighth house is one that I think tends to be a lot of fun, not because the eighth house itself is fun, but because there’s a lot of differing viewpoints throughout.
[00:05:37] Kind of like comparing the sort of more historical aspect of the eighth house to a little bit more of like a, a sort of 20th century reinterpretation of it. And so it’s one of those houses that gets talked about a lot because people are kind of coming at it from different ways. So that’s the fun part.
[00:05:51] I think the controversy of it is the fun part, not the house itself. So the eighth house, all houses really can be sort of divided into kind of subcategories. And these subcategories sort of come together to provide a better picture of what the house is of, of what that specific house does.
[00:06:08] So the eighth house specifically is a house that historically we refer to as a dark house because it is a house that does. Usually, typically line up with a, it does not typically have or share a strong aspect with the ascendant. So like the eighth, the sixth, the second, and the 12th.
[00:06:29] Are all houses that are considered dark because they lack this really strong and straightforward or direct connection with the ascendant, which represents the point of light emerging into the world. Like that’s the point of, that’s where the sun rises. So all these houses that kind of don’t have that strong geometrical relationship with this point kind of dwelling darkness a little bit.
[00:06:49] So being a dark house all these houses that are dark, not just the eight house, they tend to represent things that are a little bit more hidden, a little bit more tucked away, things that maybe we don’t wanna talk about or maybe things that we ourselves are kind of blind to. And of course, unfortunately they can also represent things that are subject subjectively negative experiences.
[00:07:09] So that’s not, that’s not super fun, but that’s just, that’s just part of it. And the eighth house isn’t alone in that. Other houses share that as well. The eighth house also is a house that is situated above the horizon. And houses that are above the horizon are a little bit more kind of solar in their emphasis.
[00:07:25] And this is more of like a, a spirit, mind versus body kind of dichotomy. So like houses under the earth. The first through the six houses tend to be a little bit more focused on the body. Whereas the houses above the earth, the sort of 12th through the seventh, tend to represent the mind or the spirit or like even other people.
[00:07:44] So there’s kind of like the, the MindSphere and then the everything else sphere. And so the eighth house being in this solar house is a little bit more mental spiritual than physical. And it also has a fun Greek name, which I’m probably gonna mispronounce because I don’t speak Greek. Where its title is Epic. Epic, which means to fall into the underworld. And this is just like the, the sort of the solar journey, right? The sun rises on the ascendant and sets on the descendant. So the eighth house tends to represent that like really strong setting motion. When the sun’s in the eighth house, this is where you start to notice like the afternoon color of the sun start to change, right?
[00:08:25] It goes from like kind of that, that bright and clear to now everything kind of has a yellow orange tent to it because the sun’s starting to, you know, fade. Nightfall is starting to approach, so the eighth house has this, like gates of the underworld, like kind of this beginning, this, this beginning of the end kind of a feel to it, which is, you know, just, just super warm and cuddly and exactly what you would want a house to represent.
[00:08:47] Amanda Walsh: Oh my gosh. You just said so much . It was, it was so illuminating already. It’s fun. I’m, I’m kind of using that word on purpose. You’re,
[00:08:55] Rhyan Butler: yeah. I was like, what an ironic word to use for the, a house like ,
[00:08:57] Amanda Walsh: you, you’re illuminating this dark house, but I love that the connotation of dark. Mm-hmm. , it, it’s, it’s literal.
[00:09:06] It’s because, yeah, absolutely. Because it doesn’t have a strong aspect to the ascendant, which is where the sun. The where the, the point of light in the chart.
[00:09:14] Rhyan Butler: Yeah. Where light breaks through.
[00:09:15] Amanda Walsh: Okay. So you mentioned I, I thought it was three other house or two other houses that are considered dark houses. Which
[00:09:27] Amanda Walsh: Okay. And you said they represent subjectively negative experiences.
[00:09:32] Right? Do you mean by that, like, when we’re having them, they don’t feel super fun and comfortable usually.
[00:09:38] Rhyan Butler: Yeah. Yeah.
9:29 Planets in the 8th House
[00:09:39] Amanda Walsh: And so if you have planets in the eighth house, does that mean you’re gonna have a lot of these subjective, subjectively negative experiences, or does it just mean that you’re, you’re gonna be good at actually handling some adversity or, or
[00:09:53] Rhyan Butler: how would you interpret that?
[00:09:54] Yeah, it can be a little bit of. . . So generally when people have like connections with the eighth house can be. It, it’ll depend a little bit on the planet involved, of course. But more the, the more difficult planets tend to be sources of anxiety or conflict within an individual. Whereas Benefic planets, those, those more helpful planets can actually serve as like, shields are barriers to these experiences and kind of help us navigate those more easily or even be in positions to help other people navigate those situations more easily.
[00:10:27] So it’s kind of one of those things where it’s like if you have planets in the eighth house, or you know, like in any of the dark houses really that are kind of like able to handle themselves, then you, then you can use that as a way to support other people who are maybe going through more difficult times.
[00:10:44] So you might see this like in individuals who are like crisis counselors or even like emergency room doctors or things like that. So, it can, it can be a bit of both. Obviously we all love it when we get to be the, the person that helps other people through crisis. But the unfortunate part of life is that there will be times when we are ourselves in crisis.
[00:11:01] For various situations. And so the eighth house can help us kind of see what those are, when those are, and how, what our immediate response to those tend to be to help us kind of be a little bit more insightful about how we manage those events, what our immediate reactions are and be like, oh, that might not be actually the best way.
[00:11:19] My, my default reaction might not actually be the best one, and can help you kind of get insight into that. Before, before that,
11:17 Malefic vs. Benefic Planets in 8th House
[00:11:26] Amanda Walsh: Hmm. And can for people that don’t know what the Monolithics and the Bens are, sure. Can you just like list, these are male maleic and these are BeneFIX and this is what it might mean if you have any of these.
[00:11:37] Rhyan Butler: Yeah. Yeah. So, typically all things being equal, which is never the case. . , Saturn and Mars tend to be more on the maleic side. Mercury kind of a little bit towards that, and then everybody else tends to be more helpful but I’m gonna make it more complicated cuz it can also depend on who is ruling what house in your chart.
[00:11:56] So like, if you have Jupiter in the eighth house and you’re like, ah, yes. Excellent. Ugh. If ju rules the 12th house in your chart, then that might be, that’s more of a damper on that because Jupyter itself will rule like a, a, a more difficult house while also being in a difficult house, which can sometimes kind of compound that.
[00:12:12] Okay. Break that
[00:12:13] Amanda Walsh: down for us. Yeah. . But, but slowly. Yeah. Just, just repeat that, but like a little bit more slow if someone’s trying to look at their chart and
[00:12:19] Rhyan Butler: follow along what you’re saying. Sure. So even though benefic planets like Jupiter, Venus, and the Sun. Tend to be more helpful or provide us with those skills or insight to maneuver some of these more difficult significations of the eighth house.
[00:12:32] If those planets are also themselves signifying an, a difficult area of the chart then that might not be such a great combination. If it rules the 12th house, if it rules the sixth house or if. Yeah, we’ll just keep it there. . Yeah, no,
[00:12:47] Amanda Walsh: no, that’s helpful because we, as we’ve been going along this series, we’ve been talking a lot about rulership and house rulers and we actually created a free guide to help people figure out how to figure out what rules what in their chart.
[00:13:02] So you can go, you can go to
[00:13:03] Amanda Walsh: astrology hub.com/ruler if you don’t know which. Planet rules your eighth house, and then how to then find where that, where else that’s showing up in your chart and then start to piece that together to create a story. Perfect. Right? Yeah. Okay. that’s astrology hub.com/ruler, and that’s free and available for anybody that’s watching this House series.
13:21 Death, Fear, Anxiety & Other People’s Money
[00:13:26] Amanda Walsh: Okay. So we’re talking about some of the things that aren’t super fun. , let’s get specific. Is this like, can the, for example, a question that comes up a lot is, can the eighth house. Death is it about money? We always hear it’s about death, taxes, money. Mm-hmm. sex. It’s like, wait, first of all, how do all these things go together?
[00:13:47] Yeah. And second of all, is that true?
[00:13:49] Rhyan Butler: Yes and no. So the big things for the eighth house for me are anxiety, fear, death, and other people’s . Money. . Anxiety, fear, and. Are all kind of related thematically in the eighth house being where we’re kind of leaning back into that dark house aspect.
[00:14:06] So it’s like things that are not super great for life. Negative experiences that we as humans don’t wanna deal with. Obviously if we could go throughout life without fear and anxiety, what a great world that would be. But you know, it’s just a part of life. It’s a part of nature, unfortunately, and we have to find ways to maneuver it
[00:14:24] so they’re all related in that, that dark aspect of it. And also the, the sort of astronomical happenstance that when the sun is in the eighth house, it’s declining. So it’s kind of like this kind of this solar journey thing that happens with the houses to where the sun is born on the ascendant, where it rises into this world and it sort of fades away and passes away as it sets on the descendant to go do.
[00:14:47] It’s like underworld journey before the cycle just keeps going. And so the eighth house kind of represents that. That old age, withering away, passing away kind of thing. So all three of those anxiety, death, and fear are kind of related to that. The other people’s money, which is sort of like the weird sore thumb sticking out in this otherwise very thematically consistent package comes from what is referred to as derived houses.
[00:15:11] And derived houses are a secondary. Interpretive system where houses take on meanings based on their relationship to other houses. Okay? So that’s a lot of words, but when it comes to the eighth house, all this really means is that the seventh house represents other people, your partner you know, your spouse, business partners other people just in the world generally.
[00:15:38] And since the eighth. Is the second house when counted from the seventh, it has some signification of other people’s money, money out there that does not belong to you. So that’s where that comes from. And you can do that with all the other houses. They’ll all have kind of some fun thing. One of my favorite jokes in astrology is that the first house, Would be the 12th house from the second.
[00:16:01] And I just think that’s really funny because like a super basic interpretation is like, I am my money’s worst enemy, which is true . I feel like that’s true for a lot of people. So that’s like one of my favorite little, like, baked in jokes for that. But derived houses, it’s a, it’s like a, it’s a bit more of like an advanced thing.
[00:16:18] I wouldn’t super worry about it. I hardly really ever use them myself professionally. Mm-hmm. . But in some instances that is an interpretive thing that gets baked.
[00:16:27] Amanda Walsh: Well, what I love about it, even if you don’t understand what it is, is it helps you understand the why. Like there there’s an actual, there’s an a logical explanation for why we just throw in other people’s money.
[00:16:38] Right, right, right.
[00:16:38] Rhyan Butler: House. It’s like, what else can we throw in here? .
[00:16:42] Amanda Walsh: It sounds fun. Let’s just throw that in.
16:39 Predicting Death
[00:16:44] Rhyan Butler: So actually I realized that we kind of forgot to answer like, the main question I guess of our previous question.
[00:16:49] Okay. Which was well maybe it wasn’t the main question, but it was like the first part of it was can death be predicted through the eight house? Oh yeah. Yeah. It was one of the things I was definitely gonna come back to that. Don’t worry. Okay, cool. . So my answer to this is it’s a little bit complicated.
[00:17:01] It’s a yes and no kind of a thing. Typically. No. And by that I mean like if you’re just looking through your chart and you’re just like looking at transits through eighth house stuff and you’re like, oh gosh, eighth house, am I gonna die? The answer is almost always no. Like, no, you’re not. There are, in, in, in the tradition there is this whole other set of things that has to happen first before we even pull that in.
[00:17:23] So there are kind of like much more complicated and technically involved length of life techniques that don’t even really involve the eighth house at all. They’re just like something else happening in the background. And the eighth house, like transits to the eighth house probably aren’t gonna mess with that at all for anybody.
[00:17:39] So my answer to that is no, however, if you are working for those astrologers or astrology enthusiasts who are interested in exploring astrology more through like poor area astrology, like answering questions or are interested in pursuing like medical astrology through like a specialized technique referred to as de temperature because those charts exist a little bit separately and they don’t have this kind of like, Fully involved length of life stuff behind them.
[00:18:07] Eighth house, stuff in those charts can be much more serious than they would be in just like a normal transit, like for you and I just right now kind of a thing. Yeah. So that’s my complicated answer to that. Very. Yes. That’s that, that seemingly very easy question. .
[00:18:23] Amanda Walsh: Well, you know, it’s funny because I’ve, I do a lot of it’s called the Cosmic Connection, another show on our podcast with Rick Levine.
[00:18:30] Mm-hmm. . And we’ve, we’ve covered this death topic quite a bit and he said, you know, ironically, There’s usually, Jupiter is, is oftentimes involved in someone’s death chart. Meaning, and, and, and one way to look at that would be that for the person transitioning, it’s actually a, it, it is a liberation, like it is an expansion and it’s, it’s really more for the people that are left behind that it can be maybe one of these very, you know, unpleasant
[00:18:59] Rhyan Butler: life experiences that you’re talking about.
[00:19:01] Yeah. As they say, death is hardest on living. Right. Exactly.
19:00 Transits in the 8th House
[00:19:05] Amanda Walsh: Yeah. Okay. So aside from death specifically mm-hmm. , when someone’s having significant transits to the eighth house, what kinds of things might be coming up for them?
[00:19:14] Rhyan Butler: Yeah, unfortunately, nothing super fun is what we can normally expect from eighth house things.
[00:19:18] Usually, like I said, eighth house will have kind of those big three things. Death, anxiety, fear kind of stuff. So. Like big transits or big activations to the eighth house can kind of force people to confront or deal with topics or situations that they feel anxious on. Like speaking personally, when I had my, I ended up suffering through like a very uh, Prolonged kind of struggle with an anxiety disorder after my most recent eighth house, perfection year after my solar return.
[00:19:46] So this kind of like big, one of those key things that you worry about with eighth house years is like, oh, I’m gonna have to deal with some something scary. Mm-hmm. . And it’s like, yes, everything, absolutely everything. And that’s not something that hopefully most people will experience, but based on like my own kind of role of the dice will say that astrology gave me when I came into this world.
[00:20:04] One of the ways that it manifested was a, a, a couple years struggle with an anxiety disorder. Mm-hmm. . And that’s a pretty, like a, that’s just like, it’s one of those things where it’s like, oh, that’s on the nose. Thanks . So textbook. Right, right, right. God, right. Yes. It’s like, well, I guess there’s a reason why it’s in the list.
[00:20:18] Amanda Walsh: When I had a activation to my eighth house, When I was going through a serious divorce. Right. Yeah. And also financial like Yeah. Serious challenges, you know? Yeah. Have to take myself outta debt and, you know, a lot of things like that. So I, I mean, I can understand what you’re saying and I remember when I was going through it, I, I met with several different astrologers because, The first one told me that I was probably going through a divorce because I, I didn’t know for sure yet what was happening.
[00:20:46] Yeah, yeah, yeah. And so I had to go to two more to make sure that it was actually true. And all of them basically were saying the same thing. I’m like, no, I, no, no, what I want to hear. But all of them also said that when you get through the other side of this, you will be. Stronger than ever. Like you will be more fortified in who you are as an individual.
[00:21:04] Mm-hmm. , there’s a power and a strength that lies for you. On the other side of this, would you say that that is also true about eighth house transits, that something is being kind of dredged up from inside of you that could be your greatest
[00:21:17] Rhyan Butler: asset? Sometimes yes. I think it depends a lot on how, a little bit at how, I guess lucky you are in.
[00:21:27] Being able to access various resources to handle whatever is coming up. And that’s not something that everybody has unfortunately. I was lucky enough to have like supportive family and to kind of have my own like meditative practice and things like that, that helped me kind of pull through my own anxiety issues.
[00:21:46] it’s something that I kind of still struggle with. It’s not at all as bad as it used to be, whether that’s made me stronger I’m about to say no. I definitely could have done without having to, you know, deal with the, with the anxiety for the past. While that could have been super fun because one thing that I think we get into some trouble with sometimes in astrology is sort of like glamorizing or romanticizing suffering by promising people that they’ll be better at the end of it.
[00:22:13] Because sometimes they’re just not, like, sometimes you just go through, sometimes you just go through hell to be in hell and there’s not really like a big cosmic lesson at the end of it. It’s just un it’s just, that’s just how it had to be, unfortunately. Right. So that’s something that I think that we as astrologers can probably get a little bit better at talking people about, but also like being there for them.
[00:22:31] If we can serve in that capacity to like be a sounding board or like to help them go to like, okay, like therapy is something you really need to look into and kind of be that, you know, if you’re, if you’re an astrology who does not have a background in like counseling or counseling or counseling counseling or, or therapy to be like, no, you actually should look into somebody like this because it seemed this could be very helpful for you.
[00:22:52] So being able to have those resources and be in contact with the people or whatever to help you develop those skills that you can use outside of the immediate, like eighth house crisis, probably can make you a much more prepared person for the world outside. But I do think a lot of it is about being able to access those resources.
[00:23:11] Amanda Walsh: Yeah, I, I would definitely say that I, well, astrology came into
[00:23:14] Rhyan Butler: my life during that time. Yeah. And astrology can absolutely be one of those resources. Absolutely. It
[00:23:18] Amanda Walsh: became the resource that I turned on so hard. It’s why I am so happy to share it with the world cuz it’s like, God, this can really, I. Be a resource that helps you through very, very, very challenging times.
[00:23:30] Hmm. And the fact that those astrologers said that to me, I don’t know if, if they could actually see that in the chart or if they were telling me something that was really Yeah. Yeah. It was, it was the most helpful thing for me here. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. I actually got to just decide that that was gonna be true because Yeah, absolutely.
[00:23:45] And so it, it was, I, it’s kind of hard to know which one precedes the other. Was it written that way or was it. It was reinforced for me and I just decided to believe it and then it became that way. Who knows,
[00:23:57] Rhyan Butler: right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. But I, like I said, you know, having, even just having somebody in your corner Yes.
[00:24:02] To be like, you can do this. Like this isn’t gonna be, this isn’t going to defeat you can be super helpful. But again, not something that everybody has unfortunately. Right. And everybody doesn’t
[00:24:11] Amanda Walsh: have someone in their corner for sure. Yep.
24:08 Relationship to Money
[00:24:13] Amanda Walsh: Okay. Tell us about the eighth house and money. We’ve talked about other people’s.
[00:24:18] What does that actually mean? Does that. It’s gonna help you find money. Does that mean other people are gonna just give you money? Like what does it actually
[00:24:25] Rhyan Butler: mean? Yeah it can usually so another thing that comes up a lot in eighth house stuff, well, maybe not a lot, is it can be instances where you receive large amounts of money,
[00:24:35] , , one thing that we cannot really move beyond the eighth house is its kind of core message of of loss in some way. So the eighth house. So, so we kind of have this access. We have the second house, which is like my stuff, right? And then we have the eighth house, which is like somebody else’s stuff, which is like definitively not my stuff.
[00:24:57] And so when we see these like second eighth house balances, one thing that we have to remember is that the eighth house can’t often represents something to where like, somebody else has this thing because I do not have this. Right. Like just basic definitions. If it’s mine, it’s not yours. Right. So what usually ends up happening is that for, for money, of course, to come to us from the eighth house, it has to, it has to come through this.
[00:25:23] It’s no longer somebody else’s money. And I bring, I say all this to say that a lot of times when eighth house money stuff gets activated, it tends to come through, inherit. Type things. So it’s like it’s no longer this other person’s money because they’re not here anymore. And now I have it, and now I might have to deal with loss, you know, in like a different, it’s like, cool, I have this, I have this thing, but I may have lost this other person in my life.
[00:25:52] In order to get this thing. So there’s this kind of like teeter-totter kind of balance aspect with the eighth house, that we normally have a very difficult time getting away from. .
25:58 Positive Aspects of the 8th House
[00:26:02] Amanda Walsh: Okay. So we’ve talked about a lot of the kind of challenging things about the eight House.
[00:26:07] From your perspective as an astrologer, is there anything that would be subjectively positive about the eight House?
[00:26:14] Rhyan Butler: Anything beneficial? Yeah, I mean, it’s a hard one. I guess getting money from, I guess getting money is generally a subjectively positive thing. But it just one of those things where the eighth house has so much kind of, So much kind of subjectively difficult stuff on it that it’s hard to pull out something that is like a supremely positive that is just like a glowingly positive thing.
[00:26:38] I have seen a lot of people who. Are who have like strong eighth house placements, kinda like I talked about before, be able to be you know, like crisis counselors emergency room doctors, people who can be there to get people through. And I would say that that is a really powerfully helpful, powerfully positive manifestation of the eighth house.
[00:26:57] But again, it’s one of those that’s like, oh, cool. I can help all these people through whatever they’re, they’re going through, but wouldn’t it just be super awesome if they just like weren’t going through this at all to begin with? Yeah. So it’s, it’s kind of like that, it’s that give and take aspect with the eighth house.
[00:27:12] Mm-hmm. .
[00:27:13] Amanda Walsh: Yeah. I mean, what I’m hearing from you is they have an un unusual ability to stay cool through adversity and crisis that they’re like, can keep their heads. They’re not gonna necessarily. Lose, lose themselves in those times because they’re, I, I know that we talked about being resourced externally Yeah.
[00:27:33] Before mm-hmm. , but I, I would guess that these people have access to a, a pretty deep, well, a deep reservoir of resource within them if they’re able, again, like you said, meditation or, you know, if, if they have tools and things that they’re using to get there. Yeah. It seems like they would probably be able to get there even.
[00:27:53] Easily than someone who doesn’t have that, that kind of placement or, or that emphasis in
[00:27:58] Rhyan Butler: their chart. Right. Right. Yeah, I think that’s perfect.
[00:28:01] Amanda Walsh: Yeah. Okay. . . All right. I, I mean, I don’t wanna put words in your mouth, but it just like, no, it’s fine. It’s like I have people in my life that, you know, maybe they have a lot, a lot, like their life is not easy, right?
[00:28:14] Like, there is sort of like a string of really challenging events and they’re the ones. Like they can actually handle the, the hard things. They, they, they weren’t, they, they haven’t gone through life on a silver spoon mm-hmm. . And they’re actually able to really like, wait, does that
[00:28:30] Rhyan Butler: make sense? Go through life.
[00:28:30] Yeah. No, well, I’m, I, I knew Silver Spoon in their mouth. . I knew what you meant. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. There is sort of that aspect, you know, it, it’s that again, kind of that give and take kind of aspect of the eight house. In that unfortunately the people who kind of come. As those individuals who can be sources of strength or comfort or resource, other people often themselves went through something very, very difficult.
[00:28:53] Yeah. And so they’ve been able to kind of take that and turn it into something, but it’s like, cool. But they still had to like, go through that Really? Yeah. Kind of challenging period to come out of it as something like much more. So it’s like we’ve I don’t sort of like transmuted the. Into something much more helpful, which can be awesome, but it’s like, man, why did I, like, why did I have to go through like this?
[00:29:16] The good thing I guess is with you kind of continuing on that, that kind of statement, I guess that a lot of people who are able to kind of access this or have these, like this emphasis with the eighth house, but tend that tends to be more positive, is that they can be really good like cycle breakers.
[00:29:32] Themselves. Like, you know, those people who have those, like, my parent, you know, it, they like having that kind of reflection of being like, my parenting was like this. I didn’t like it, so I’m not gonna do that to my kids. You know what I mean? Yes. Like that kinda a thing.
[00:29:45] Amanda Walsh: Hmm. That’s, yeah. I, I get what you’re saying.
[00:29:48] It’s like none of these experiences we would ever wish for ourselves or wish for anybody else, you know? Right. To have a, a horrible childhood or be abused as a child, any of this. Right. It’s not like, oh, well, it’s worth it to, to be, to then help other people’s. Like, no, it’s not . I don’t know. You know, and who would I be to say that to you?
[00:30:05] Right. , however, I see what you’re saying. It’s, it’s this give and take. You’re, you’re losing something in order to gain something or gain some, you’re gaining something and losing something at the same time. Yeah. And it really, I keep seeing this horizon line. Yeah, exactly. And how it’s like the sun is going away, so you’re losing the light, but you’re gaining the dark.
[00:30:24] Can you Yeah. Is, can you use that ? Yeah. Yeah. Like, yes, exactly.
[00:30:29] Rhyan Butler: Yeah. Okay. Really good. Yeah. And like the best thing that you can hope for with the eighth house is that whatever, whatever, like the negative part of it is, like whatever the loss of it is, is something that you ultimately didn’t really care. Mm.
[00:30:38] To get something that you ultimately do care about at the end of it. And sometimes we’re not always able to make those negotiations . You know what I mean? Right. So, but so it can be one of those things that can be that, that can be used that way. It’s just Mm. We don’t always get to pick, unfortunately.
30:49 What is the Occult?
[00:30:54] Amanda Walsh: Okay. Question for you about the occult, an eighth house being re related to the occult. First of all, what is the occult? And second of all is the second, is the eighth house actually
[00:31:05] Rhyan Butler: related to it? Yeah. So what is the occult? Well . That is a philosophical question I was not anticipating . So the word occult just means like that which is hidden
[00:31:14] and so that’s kind of an interesting thing to look at, like through the lens of the eighth house, which is a house which has a lot of like hidden things to it, like things that we don’t necessarily wanna talk about. Things that we kind of stuff away to the side. So in some regard, I do think the eighth house does ha, it has like an occult connection kind of on like a definitive kind of a level.
[00:31:31] I have never been very comfortable with the idea of like occult type topics being associated with the eighth house. I think that’s much more like a ninth house kind of a thing. The ninth house being a place where we go to like expand ourselves, like be open to things like spirituality, where we seek advice from, you know, whatever higher power it is that you subscribe to or that you follow.
[00:31:51] That’s not really something that I see a lot in the eighth house. The eighth house isn’t really a place I would go to for like spiritual upliftment, you know what I mean? Like, that’s not, it’s not super fun.
[00:32:00] Amanda Walsh: Yeah. But it’s interesting that, that it follows the, the one that would be more about spiritual upliftment follows the eighth house.
[00:32:09] Rhyan Butler: You know?
[00:32:09] Amanda Walsh: Yeah. mean, just in terms of the tr the journey or the trajectory of, going through the houses in, in a continuous way. Mm-hmm. , you know, one leading to the next. It, it’s just an interesting observation.
[00:32:20] Rhyan Butler: So, yeah, when it comes to like those kind of like spiritually oriented kind of occult things, I’m not sure the eighth house is a super great fit for it. But it is interesting to see in like other contexts how situations involving the eighth house can themselves be AOC cult and that it’s like hidden stuff.
[00:32:37] Things that aren’t, like, things that aren’t super easy to see. So like from a more. Physical medical astrology kind of standpoint stuff in the eighth house can be like illnesses or injuries that are hidden that take a little bit more kind of digging to find. So there is definitely some, some crossover there for the eighth house and the occult, but.
[00:32:58] I guess it, I guess it depends a little bit on how one exactly describes or maybe like themselves experiences, like what one defines as like the cult type subjects. Right. And that’s not something I can like personally, like prescribe to people, you know.
33:08 Beyond the Veil Experiences
[00:33:13] Rhyan Butler: Could it
[00:33:13] Amanda Walsh: be like otherworldly type things or like beyond the veil type things, like near death experiences mm-hmm.
[00:33:21] or experiences with, you know, people who have died or, you know, are, are beyond the veil are quote
[00:33:28] Rhyan Butler: unquote hidden. Sure, sure, sure. I would, I would think so, yes. Because I also will see eight house stuff in individuals who work within the hospice care industry. Hmm. Yes. So I don’t think, I don’t think it’s too much of a jump to go from that to like, a little bit more of a less physical kind of interaction with the, with, with the, with those who have passed.
[00:33:49] Amanda Walsh: Okay. Now, I’ve also heard in terms of the, the categories that the eighth house includes death, other people’s money, taxes, but also sex. Mm-hmm. , do you, do you put that in in that house or is that more fifth?
[00:34:06] Yeah. I have never been one to ascribe sex to the eighth house. Where that has kind of come from is sort of a bit more of a like 20th century sort of re configuration, I guess, of the houses to where houses.
[00:34:22] And the sign to the zodiac started to kind of smash up against one another to bleed into one another with their different meanings. And that’s not like historically signs of the Zodiac have kind been over here. Houses have kinda been over here. They have their own sort of like, Descriptive categories or like I talked about the eighth house in the beginning.
[00:34:39] It’s like, it’s a dark house. It’s, you know, it falls into the underworld. It’s a solar house. It has its own kind of combinations or descriptions of meaning that, that bring it out. But in like the 20th century, there was a push to kind of combine the houses and the science together. . And Scorpio of course is the eighth sign.
[00:34:55] It gets attached to the eighth house. Scorpio medically is associated with the genitals and what do you do with your genitals? So that’s where the sex aspect of it came from. Mm-hmm. . And that’s never really been something I’ve been super excited about, just because knowing where the a like knowing kind of the, the, the.
[00:35:16] The trajectory of the eight house, the theme of the eight house. I don’t like combining those two things. . Yeah. That sounds very scary to me. And it’s just like, you know, sexual assault is already super common. Let’s not , let’s not, let’s not play with that anymore.
[00:35:31] Hmm. Interesting. So what, where would you put sex then?
[00:35:34] Rhyan Butler: I think the fifth house, probably like, I think the fifth House probably makes a lot more sense. The fifth house is typically a house that has much more like positive, pleasurable experiences for the body specifically. And of course the fifth. Representing, you know, children if we choose to have them.:
[00:35:49] Mm-hmm. , it just seems like a duh cause effect, , right, right, right outta the situation.
35:49 No Planets in the 8th House
[00:35:53] Amanda Walsh: Yeah. What happens if you have no planets in the eight house? Does that signify anything?
[00:36:00] Rhyan Butler: Unfortunately While some of us may be lucky enough to avoid having planets in the eighth house, that doesn’t keep us completely out of the grip of the eighth house
[00:36:08] Going back to the rulership resource that you mentioned earlier, everybody has a planet that will rule the eighth house, and so will, it’s, its job is then to kind of take up responsibility for eighth house topics and kind of do, do whatever it can with those topics based on how it’s positioned in your.
[00:36:27] What it’s up to, what it’s doing. So we can never quite escape the eighth house. There will always be you know, there will always be an eighth house ruler from which to emanate eighth house gunk into our lives. And then it’s just about, part of the magic of astrology is knowing where that is, knowing what that looks like, and being able to like have our feelers out for when that time.
[00:36:50] For that planet being more involved in our life is coming, so we can kind of get our, get everything ready for whatever kind of shake up the eighth house Lord might be trying to bring into our lives.
[00:37:02] Amanda Walsh: I,
36:58 Navigation Tools for 8th House Transits
[00:37:02] Amanda Walsh: I wanted to ask you that question. So when people are looking at their charts and they’re looking at their transits and they’re like, oh God, like I’m going into an eighth house transit, or, you know, I have all this energy in my eighth house.
[00:37:13] Mm. What, what do you say to clients or people that you’re working with when they’re like in that, that anticipatory stance that, that, you know, has them feeling a lot of anxiety already, even before this
[00:37:27] Rhyan Butler: thing even happened? Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Isn’t that just the fun part of it though? Like, you’re pre you’re pre anxiety.
[00:37:32] Anxiety. Like, I don’t know what this is, but I’m already afraid of it. Right. Yeah. So, one thing that helped me a lot. In my, like I mentioned before, I went through a pretty prolonged period of time where I struggled with an anxiety disorder. One of the things that helped me get through it and something that I repeat to clients though I’m not at all licensed to be a counselor or a therapist or anything back like that, is just sort of like, I eventually realized that whatever sort of like nightmare scenario I invented in my head actually isn’t happening.
[00:38:01] Hmm. And so, but as long as I’m there, it is happening to me. Right, right now, if that made any sense. Yeah. Oh yeah. So it’s like, it’s like I can choose to be there in this nightmare future that may not ever happen, or I can choose to be here where it’s not happened, and it may never happen. And so that’s something that I, that I try to pass on to people who are kind of going through that.
[00:38:19] It’s like, okay, well it’s not here yet. It’s good to be kind of aware that it’s on the horizon. Cause that’s literally the first step of devising any sort of plan, is just knowing that it’s, knowing that there’s something happening. and then we kind of like start digging into, you know, like the symbolism of what’s happening in their chart specifically and saying, okay, so these are, these are the areas where it looks like things might, like, this is where it looks like the impact point is gonna be basically.
[00:38:44] So what are actionable things that we can do now to cover this from being a bigger problem than if we had done nothing at. Exactly. And it
[00:38:52] Amanda Walsh: goes back to what you said before, that the ability to take any of these transits and turn, it’s like turn lemons into lemonade. And I’m not saying, I don’t think you ever want the lemons in the first place.
[00:39:02] No, no. You’re gonna have the lemons may as well work with it as, as, as well as you can, right? Yeah. But what, what you said is that, being resourced is the first, is the most important variable, and being able to do that. Right. And so it seems to me like what you just said, having the awareness and then knowing a little bit about where it might hit you personally in your chart and then getting the resources you
[00:39:27] Rhyan Butler: need.
[00:39:27] Yeah, even preempted, even just lined up. Yes,
[00:39:30] Amanda Walsh: exactly. And, and I was gonna ask you that too because I’ve had, I’ve had in my own life times of like, God, do I really wanna know? Like, is it better to just not know? Is it better to just sort of like free fall into these things? And when I reflect on my life, I have had times where I didn’t have astrology in my life.
[00:39:47] Mm-hmm. and I went through some really hard times and it was super challenging. And having astrology in my life and having the foresight. has helped me again, not avoid any of this stuff. Mm-hmm. , that’s really hard, but at least feel like I have some, some, like bearing through it. Some like, anchor in it.
[00:40:06] Yeah. You know, in the storm. It’s like, okay, a, you have an idea of
[00:40:10] Rhyan Butler: how long it’s gonna last. Yeah, exactly. Really helpful. Right? That’s what I was gonna say. Go ahead. Yeah, yeah. No, it’s like, one of my, one of my biggest points when it comes to like consultations is like harm reduction in some way. Yeah.
[00:40:21] It’s like, you know, you’re gonna go through difficult times. It’s normal. Everybody does it. It sucks when it’s our turn, you know? Yes. But if we can kind of know what’s gonna happen before this eighth house thing starts and kinda give an idea of what’s going on, then we can start reducing. How much it’s gonna, how much of a bother it’s gonna be to us.
[00:40:37] And even in a situation where there may be not anything that we can do necessarily, because sometimes eight house transits only will reflect on us what’s happening to somebody else. Like the loss of a loved one. Like we can’t really do anything about that. Right? But we can kind of get our own self ready to go through.
[00:40:55] Yes. You know what I mean? So even when there’s a situation where we have no control over, over what’s gonna happen the least, the very least that you have is a start date and an end date, and as long as you can pull through to the end date. Your league’s ahead. . Oh my
[00:41:10] Amanda Walsh: gosh. Exactly. I remember that asking that question a million, like
[00:41:13] Rhyan Butler: how, when is this ending?
[00:41:14] When is it over ? It’s like, it’s like
[00:41:16] Amanda Walsh: the little kinks in the backseat. Like, are we almost there? Are we there yet? , I kept asking strollers like, am I almost there yet? Am I almost through this? It’s just, it’s it, when you’re in those times, it can feel just like it’ll never end, but Right. One of the other things that astrology shows us is, Everything’s always changing.
[00:41:32] Yeah. Like, it, it, you can, you won’t stay in that place forever. It will shift. Yeah. So I, and I’m, I’m speaking right now to anybody who’s like actually looking at their chart or in an eighth house situation right now and just acknowledging that it’s. Super challenging. There’s no, like, there’s no sugarcoating.
[00:41:50] Yeah. Those, those experiences, they just are really challenging. And it’s interesting how when we come into this life, it’s like we have a d i, I keep thinking of our astrology chart. It’s almost like our dance card. , you know, it’s like you have this lineup of mm-hmm. things that there’s not, there’s nothing you can really do about that.
[00:42:08] But how you meet it and how you engage with it and how you work with it, that is the part that you do have some control over. Right?
[00:42:14] Rhyan Butler: Yeah. Yeah.
42:11 Ryhan’s Favorite House
[00:42:15] Amanda Walsh: Yeah. Ryan, this has been so much fun to talk with you. Is I, I’m curious, what is your favorite house in the
[00:42:24] Rhyan Butler: house? Oh, in all the houses. Question. Oh, what is my favorite house?
[00:42:27] I think my favorite house is probably the sixth. The six
[00:42:29] Amanda Walsh: house. Mm-hmm. . And just give us a quick why because we’ve already been there. So we’ve,
[00:42:33] Ryhan Butler: we’ve gotten I have four planets there. Yeah. And what do you like about it? I like that . I like that it signifies like small animals and pets and that I have four planets there and I have a lot of pets.
[00:42:45] So it just feels right to me. It, it’s like, yes, that checks out .
[00:42:49] Amanda Walsh: I love it.
42:45 Ryhan’s Mastery Class
[00:42:50] Amanda Walsh: Ryan you’re gonna be an inner circle astrologer with us soon, and I’m wondering if you have an idea of the mastery class that you’re gonna teach. What’s, what technique or tool are you gonna teach?
[00:43:00] Rhyan Butler: Yeah. It looks like unless there’s some kind of change, whatever that I’m talking about, natal temperament.
[00:43:06] Natal temperament. What’s that? Yeah. So natal temperament going kind of back to my, to my roots as a medieval astrologer it’s very similar to how people like talk about like having or like, will Oh, like calculate elements in their chart. Yeah. Like, oh, I have so many planets and air signs and blah, blah, blah.
[00:43:22] So it’s kind of like that. Except for it is a categorizing or kind of summing up an individual’s chart based off of one of the four classical temperaments, caloric phlegmatic melancholic and sanguine. And then exploring how those affect us on, like personality affect our bodies, affect how we react to things.
[00:43:39] So it’s a little bit of a, sort of like a, an an introductory. Classical medical astrology technique that people can go in and explore for themselves, get an idea of what, how their astrology lines up to their own lived experiences. Because kinda like you said, what astrology tells us is that everything changes and that, and natal te inherent temperament can change over our lives while also kind of giving people a little bit more of some actionable information about how they can adjust things in their lives to match or counter whatever their kind of dominant temperament reaction style is.
[00:44:10] If they are maybe unhappy with what their natural reaction to things tends to be. Wow,
[00:44:16] Amanda Walsh: Ryan, I, I my children have gone through a lot of Waldorf education. Okay. Yes. They use the temperaments. Yep. Yes, they do. Understanding the kids, and I didn’t realize there was an astrological underpinning to that. Yep.
[00:44:28] I mean, I knew it mapped to like the elements. Mm-hmm. , you know, but I didn’t know that there’s an actual astrological technique that helps us. Not guess what? Yeah, but no. In your child’s temperament is , but actually no. Mm-hmm. . Wow. That’s fascinating. Amazing.
[00:44:42] Amanda Walsh: Really looking forward to that. If any of you are interested in learning from Ryan and 12 other astrologers who are amazing, who you’ve been meeting as a.
[00:44:51] Part of this House series, you can sign up to get on the wait list for the Inner Circle. We are gonna be opening up enrollment very, very soon, and you’ll be the first to know if you’re on the wait list. You also get a free mastery class when you join the wait list, so you can go to
[00:45:06] Amanda Walsh: astrology hub.com/ic 23.
[00:45:10] That’s I c as in Cat 23. I know that Ryan has cats, so that’s, I use that on purpose.
[00:45:16] Rhyan Butler: Yeah, I thought you were gonna say if you want to join Ryan in the 12, in his 12 cats, it’s like, oh, how’d she know? . 12 cats For real? No, but no, they’re like, they’re like outside cats that I watch that aren’t like mine.
[00:45:27] You know what I mean? So I guess by sun bearings I could have, but no, I don’t . Oh, I
[00:45:31] Amanda Walsh: love it. And you, and you’re a Leo’s son and a a Leo Moon, right? Yeah, surrounded by cats. It’s perfect. I love it. If you wanna get on the wait list now, now’s the time to do it. Astrology hub.com/ic 23. We would love to see you in the inner circle working with these astrologers, really helping to make astrology something that you can immediately apply in your life.
[00:45:54] You, you, you learn techniques every single month that you can take. You can apply them to your chart. You can actually use astrology. In a very practical and tangible way. So our, one of our main goals in the inner circle is to help reduce the overwhelm, reduce the noise, you know, like make it easy for you to just focus in on one place.
[00:46:14] You know, you’re gonna be there every single month and you get, you know, guided through all the different energetic signatures of each month. And plus you get to get these different tools as you go through the year. So, Really looking forward to having you, Ryan, as an inner circle astrologer guide with us, and just thank you for being here with us on the House series.
[00:46:33] It’s been super fun to, to get to know you here and to introduce you to our community.
[00:46:37] Rhyan Butler: Yeah, super fun to be here. Sorry I had to meet everybody by being a DOR and talking to the house, but yeah, hopefully it was fun.
[00:46:45] Amanda Walsh: This, this probably was the one house that astrologers are like, God, I hope I don’t get the eight house.
[00:46:49] Or you know, of all the houses. That’d be like, n not the most fun to do. But thank you for showing up and doing it and you did a great job. And , sometimes, sometimes we just need to know the truth and it, it’s not always, it’s not always rainbows and U in unicorns.
[00:47:02] Rhyan Butler: Oh, I wish though.
[00:47:05] Amanda Walsh: I love that. It’s like the Leo part of you. Just like I, I, I wish.
[00:47:08] Rhyan Butler: So why can’t it just be, it’s like, why can’t it? Yeah, why not? Yeah. who said I who
[00:47:13] Amanda Walsh: said, yeah. Can we, can we just change the code? Can we just change the design? Cuz we don’t really all need this. Awesome. Ryan, thank you so much. Thank you all for being here.
[00:47:20] Thank you for being a part of this House series. We’ve loved sharing this content with you, and thank you for being a part of our community. Thank you as always for making astrology a part of your life. We’ll catch you on the next episode. Stay tuned for the ninth house coming next week. Take care.