[COSMIC CONNECTION] How to approach an Astrology Critic w/ Rick Merlin Levine

Listen here:

In this episode of the Astrology Hub Podcast, Astrologer Rick Levine and Amanda ‘Pua’ Walsh discuss “How to approach an Astrology Critic.”

You'll learn…

    • Ways in which Astrology has faced ridicule through history.
    • The core fallacies present in modern astrological skepticism.
    • How Michele Gauquelin contributed to Astrology's mainstream acceptance.
    • About Johannes Kepler's Astrological past.
    • Ways in which Western and Eastern Astrology can work together.
    • About the current state of Astrology in academic discourse.

Chapters

0:00 Intro

01:30 Announcements from Rick

6:15 Examples of Astrology being publicly ridiculed

20:29 Astrology and Family Conflict

25:00 Fallacies of Astrology Skepticism

28:00 Michel Gauquelin & The Mars Effect

33:55 Astrology and the Scientific Method

35:00 Antoine Lavoisier and Circular Reasoning

40:00 The Eastern vs Western Astrology argument

44:20 The Astrology of Johannes Kepler

51:26 Diana Stone on Making Astrology Mainstream

54:50 Astrology in Modern Times

1:12:00 Closing Thoughts

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Transcript

This transcript is automatically generated. Some miswording might be present.

00:00:05 [Amanda Pua Walsh] Welcome to the cosmic connection presented by Astrology Hub. I'm your host, Amanda Pua Walsh, founder of Astrology have here with master astrologer, Rick Merlin, Levine. This is your place to explore the order and beauty of the cosmos and your connection to it all. Well, hello everybody. And welcome, Rick, what do you think about our new intro?

00:00:29 [Rick Merlin Levine] I love it.

00:00:30 It's wonderful. I'm happy to be here with her without introduction, but with introduction is even better.

00:00:38 [Amanda] Yeah. We, we custom tailored the sound to fit your vibe. So I hope that you're digging

00:00:45 [Rick] I like it.

00:00:46 [Amanda] Great. All right. Well welcome everybody. We're so happy you're here today. We are going to be talking about how to, how to approach an astrology critic.

00:00:57 This question comes up again and again and again. So we want to address it here today. And I know before we dive in that Rick had a few announcements that he would like to make.

00:01:09 [Rick] I do. And then I want to say something about the title, but let me do the two short announcements. Number one, as many of you know,

00:01:17 I, I do a daily column called the daily planet polls on Instagram and have for a couple of years now. And that site was stolen and hacked, and I've been fighting with Instagram for about, well, since the last mercury retrograde cycle. And I just had to walk away from it. So my old name, Rick Levine astrologer is now live again,

00:01:42 but it's a brand new account. So if you want to follow my daily writing is not really a horoscope. It's kind of more of a daily astrological reflection on what's going on. That's Rick Levine, astrologer on Instagram. Tell your friends, tell your relatives and follow me. That's not okay.

00:02:02 [Amanda] Yeah, let's help Rick build back up his, his phone.

00:02:05 [Rick] That's right. And in, in defiance of, of mercury retrograde, actually that's a perfect use of mercury retrograde because I'm going back and digging something back up from the past. Hopefully the second thing is that I will be a featured speaker at the conscious life expo, which is an annual event in Los Angeles. It's held at the lax Hilton. That's the Hilton at lax at the airport in LA.

00:02:35 And I'm going to be on a panel and doing a number of free lectures and some paid lectures. And on the Monday of that, after the actual expo itself on February 7th, the expo is the fourth to the seventh. I'll be doing three segments of an all-day workshop. Information is available. If you go to consciouslifeexpo.com and dig down, it's a huge event.

00:03:05 There's hundreds or maybe 80. I didn't really count speakers. And if you're in the LA area and you're an Astrology Hub, or please come up and introduce yourself, I'd love to meet you.

00:03:19 [Amanda] What are you going to be talking about?

00:03:22 [Rick] Well, I think there's actually six separate events that I'm involved in. One is a panel discussion with a number of other astrologists,

00:03:32 including David Palmer, the Leo king. So we'll be on that panel together. And that will be fun. That'll be, I think Saturday afternoon or evening, but I'll be doing a talk on why do we, you know, what can we get out of astrology? I'll be doing a talk, which is one of my favorite topics, the planets in your pocket,

00:03:52 how to use the various planets and pull out Mars when you need it and shove away Saturn when you don't want them around. And then how do you, how do you work with them in real life without looking at a horoscope, without reading, just understanding that these planets are parts of you and your friends, I'll be doing a w one of the workshop sessions will be on an astrological.

00:04:18 Check-in where the hell are we time-wise in the big scheme of things. They'll also be doing a showing of Rick Tarnas', changing of the gods. I know that you have Rick on for an interview, which I'm totally excited about because you are my favorite interviewER, and Rick is, is a long time and favorite interviewEE so I'm looking forward to that,

00:04:44 but there'll be doing a screening and then afterwards there's going to be an astrological panel. I'll be on that to kind of discuss with the audience what all this means and so on. So it's a whole sequence of events. I'll be doing one lecture on Astrology and reincarnation, which we've talked about here in previous episodes, but they have me working. I think I'm,

00:05:06 I think I'm doing three events on Saturday with them two on Sunday and three on Monday. And so it's, it's, it's an honor to be one of the featured speakers, rather than just one of the hundred or 80 or 73. Like I said, I didn't count anyhow. So that's that LA February 4th through seventh and, and online, they have their complete program.

00:05:36 It's a deep program. The, the person who puts the program on is excited because this is the first year that they've had a full Astrology track all the way through it. It's, you know, it's more been, you know, like UFO's and psychic stuff and, and, and lifestyle stuff. And that'll be there. I mean, there are big names.

00:06:01 Dannion Brinkley, George Nori. I mean, it's, it's, it's a huge event, but I'm very, very proud to be their lead astrologer on their first time of an astrology track. So if you're in the LA area, February 4th through the seventh, tell him I sent you, it probably won't, it probably won't matter.

00:06:24 [Amanda] I'm saying it'd be worth the trip, even if you're close and you can get to LA, it sounds like it'd be an amazing event to go to. Yeah. So, and then you wanted to say something about the title, how to approach an astrology critic.

00:06:42 [Rick] Yeah. I, I think that you don't know. I think the real, the real topic, although, you know, me and picking words apart,

00:06:51 it's not, how do you approach an astrology critic? It's what do you do when one approaches you when they're unwanted? Because, because anyone who has been an astrologer or even who reads their horoscopes, who's not considering becoming a professional, but just knows the value of astrology. Everyone who's been in that camp has been made fun of at some point in time,
00:07:21 by someone they thought they really liked.

00:07:24 [Amanda] Absolutely. I've been told by a family member that I'm an embarrassment like, whoa, wow. And so is this, is this a good time to share the response we just recently got? So we are in the process of developing a new app and it's going to connect you, the audience, our community with astrologers who have readings,

00:07:49 either on demand and or you can book readings for the future. So we've been working really hard on this, behind the scenes. And we got to the point where we were ready to submit our app to the apple developer store, you know, like to the actual program itself, to get approved for apple devices. And we received this notice from them now twice,

00:08:14 you won't believe this. I mean, okay. So regarding guideline four dot three, your app still primarily features astrology, horoscopes, Palm, reading, fortune telling or Zodiac reports. Okay. Now I'm going to read to you what guideline four dot three says the app store has enough fart, burp flashlight, fortune telling, dating, drinking games and Kama,

00:08:41 Sutra apps, et cetera. We will reject these apps unless they provide a unique high quality experience. Spamming the store may lead to your removal from the apple developer program. So we re have received this rejection from them now twice, simply because it's an astrology app and it is very unique. Nobody else, as far as I know is using the apps to actually connect people for readings.

00:09:10 So it is, is unique, but they're lumping us in with all of those other categories of apps that they consider spam. So I just it's, to me, it was this another moment of wow, like astrology, as much as we think it's becoming normalized is still on the fringe.

00:09:30 [Rick] I, I, I see, I see a, a chapter of a book about your history and the title of this chapter is the Astrology Hub and other fart jokes.

00:09:43 [Amanda] Great. Can you help me write that chapter? I think that's really good.

00:09:50 [Rick] Oh my God. Well, you know, unfortunately you said this might surprise some of you. It doesn't surprise me at all at all at all. I mean, there are people who I really respect who I like or I like, listen, Stephen Kober, comes to mind.

00:10:08 I hate to pick on you, Steven. But you know, there's a smart guy, you know, he's lived his childhood doing Dungeons and dragons, and he's probably read Lord of the rings more times, you know, then than Tolkien himself. And yet every chance she gets to do some sort of slight about, well, it could get worse, it could be Astrology or,

00:10:32 you know, you know, or something like that. He, I he's had his friend, Neil deGrasse Tyson on several times and they can't get through a whole session with out taking a couple of hits, you know, at, at, at Astrology, John Oliver, a while back did a whole thing, you know, on, on the stupidity of astrology.

00:10:55 And most recently two things came up, which is really what prompted me to want to talk about this. I came across a site called professor Dave explains on YouTube. You can Google it. You can go to YouTube. And professor Dave explains and I actually was very, was quite impressed, impressed enough with one. And I'd only seen one of his episodes ever.

00:11:29 And it was basically him responding publicly to people, respond to a group of people, responding to him publicly about his denial of flat earth. And I thought his thing was pretty good. I mean, it was, there were other things that I thought that he was missing and I actually wrote him, or I did a post on, on that page that basically said,

00:12:01 when I am confronted with flat earth people, here's a list of 17 questions. I, I give to them in writing and say, when you can answer any three or four of them minimum, then I'll talk to you. But until then, no thanks. But then I went back to his site and I looked at something else and I came across another posting of his called quantum mysticism is stupid Deepak Chopra,

00:12:34 spirit science, actualized.org, et cetera. This Justin quantum physics tells us that consciousness creates reality, blah, blah, blah, blah. And, and it was, you know, 25 minutes of him just making fun of something he really didn't know about. And of course, then that led me to his Astrology fact or fiction. And, and it's basically 28 minutes of him.

00:13:06 Well, by the end of it, his conclusion was, so there you have it, look, it's black and white. If you believe in astrology, you're stupid. End of story.

00:13:19 [Amanda] Right.

00:13:21 [Rick] And that was it. And I went through my to jump in and tried to set this guy, right. You, I just, you know, you know,

00:13:30 hire someone to beat them up. That's I'm kidding. I would never do that. You know? Or do I just let it go? And, and, and I may have mentioned this to you once before Amanda, maybe when we did the episode on how Astrology is the one thing that, that fundamental religions, including Catholicism and scientists can agree on.

00:13:58 And they both, they agree on the fact that Astrology is a blight is a wart exercise. It exorcise it not exercise it like your dog, but cut it off, get rid of it. And I think in that session, I might have told the story that I was very sad when Carl Sagan, the guy, the astronomer, who did the original cosmos when he passed away,

00:14:26 because one of my early adult hood goals in life was to be on a, an hour live debate on a national network. Back when there were only three national four, three or four national networks that if something was on TV, everyone watched it because there was no, well, you know, we live in a different world now, but, but I wanted have an hour publicly debating astrology with Carl Sagan because I felt that Carl Sagan,

00:15:00 although he in cosmos also makes fun of astrology, but certainly dismisses it as a, you know, something not to pay attention to. Although he was maybe the only well-known scientist in 1986, when 186 well-known scientists and Nobel laureates signed a document that was taken out as a full page ad in science magazine, basically warning the public against the charlatans who practice astrology and Carl Sagan refused to sign it.

00:15:43 And I respect him for that and he refused to sign it because he said I haven't studied it enough to really, you know, to be an expert in it, which leads me to the, when scientist tells me that Astrology is, you know, is bullshit immediately. I, and this is not this session today is not about quick retorts and responses,

00:16:08 although I have a number of them, but I'm always reminded of, and will sometimes mention that Nobel Laureate, Richard Fineman, Nobel Laureate in physics said that when it comes to non-scientific matters, scientists are just as stupid as the next guy. Hmm.

00:16:30 [Amanda] Well, you would be my number one, pick Rick, if we ever did have an opportunity to debate Neal Neal Neal.

00:16:39 [Rick] Yeah. You know, but unfortunately I there's that famous line of someone saying to D I was one of the, in one of the presidential things was, and you are no, John Kennedy. I, there was, you know, Neil do grass is, is Tyson is, is no Carl Sagan. I mean, Carl had his faults. I didn't know him personally.

00:17:07 But the problem is that when you approach something from a perspective that you already know, then everything validates what you already know. And, and this poor guy, professor Dave just picks the, he picks things to, to prove that astrology is not valid. And he picks things that are misinterpretations or, or things that are just not part of astrology. And here in of course,

00:17:40 we get to Astrology his largest problem. And that's a PR problem. I always think of this story, which I might have also told in that session, but a young, a young man, a teenager probably kind of radical in trouble kid goes in for confession and he sits down and he says to the priest, before we start, I just want to make sure,

00:18:04 you know, I don't even believe in God. And the priest says without even blinking an eye, he goes, oh, that's okay. I don't believe in God, either. And now the kids kind of like, why you're a priest? What do you mean you don't believe in God? And the priest says, I don't believe in the God you don't believe in.

00:18:23 And it turns out when someone says, I don't believe in astrology. I go, yeah, I need to do I, you know, whatever it is that you think Astrology is that you're not believing in, count me out. I don't believe in that either. So that's often a good starting point that simply disarm someone. But I think the deeper question here is,

00:18:45 do we need to, or is it our job? Is it our responsibility to defend Astrology or to take on someone who is needling us? Or, I mean, critics are bad enough, but, but we also run into people who just ridicule, you know, just absolutely, you know, make you into a laughing stock, tell it, stock telling,

00:19:10 you know, jokes about this stupidity, you know, have a Astrology or, or horoscopes because that's really many people only know of horoscopes. And of course, if I'm involved in that situation, sometimes people wish they didn't start it because I am one of those unusual astrologers, you know, who spent 20 years writing daily horoscopes for the public. And I'm also pretty well-trained technically.

00:19:41 And so I know the difference and I know the use of, of each, and I know the limitations of daily horoscopes that they are not to be confused with quote, unquote horoscopic or real Astrology. But, but it's a deeper question than what do I, what do I say the deeper question is, do I say anything? Are you,

00:20:05 [Amanda] And yeah, that is the question. I mean, I think probably most people in the audience and I would agree with this too, is that most of the time? No, unless there is a true curiosity and someone really is asking sincerely, but otherwise it's like, they're not going to hear you. There's no point in trying to convince it's a big waste of energy, but

00:20:29 [Rick] Well, family gatherings is maybe the worst place.

00:20:33 [Amanda] What was amazing Rick at the last family gathering? I mean, this has been a slow process now of about 10 years with my family, but I actually got to tell them the astronomical origins of Christmas, we all went around. We, we all went around and shared some things about Christmas and they listened so intently.

00:20:55 It was amazing. And we also got to sing your song, the deck, the whole song again, but we changed it a little bit. So every Zodiac sign is included and all that good stuff. But I mean, so I've, I've noticed a softening over time

00:21:10 [Rick] For people who don't know, one year in a fit of craziness. I sat down with about,

00:21:15 I don't know, maybe eight or 10 of the best known Christmas carols. And I rewrote the words, astrologically deck, the charts with trines and sextiles or oh, mercury retrograde of mercury, you know, instead of a little town of Bethlehem

00:21:32 [Amanda] Also call the Leo call to Leo's makeup party follow up. So we did that one. Yeah. Anyways. So I've noticed a softening over time and I really haven't pushed it.

00:21:43 I really just wait until they ask me and it's an invited, but I mean, I think for the most part, if there's, there is a little opening and you have solid information, it it's, it's fun to share. And a lot of times people will be like, oh yeah, I'm actually really curious about I I'm. I am interested.

00:22:00 [Rick] So I ha I have an older brother, three years older, younger sister, three years younger. And in all the time that I've ever spent with them as an adult, they've neither of them have ever asked me to look at their chart.

00:22:17 [Amanda] Whoa. And I never have volunteered. They are so Missing out.

00:22:22 [Rick] Well, you know, they, they,

00:22:24 they don't know, but it's not, Whatever it, it, I mean, it's, I find it more humorous, not humorous. Isn't quite the right word. There's something I find lovely. You know, there's just so, I mean, it's just perfect, but you talk about, you know,

00:22:48 not being seen now, I, my brother is, is a scientist is a, a geologist and he's come around a long way. He and he, he doesn't quite, you know, throw it away as quickly as he once did, but, but we've never really had that the discussion, I would love to have it, but I'll only have that discussion these days,

00:23:21 if invited all, although I'm thinking about doing a 10 or 15 minute YouTube, that is to professor Dave and raking him over the coals and maybe even my problem is that when I get into something like this, I'm, I'm, you know, I'm a, I'm a 4 planet in Aries guy. And I pretty much control my, my anger,

00:23:51 my combativeness, my contentiousness enough, you know, I have a soft, gentle cancer moon and, and a clever Gemini rising. But when I get pissed, I go over the edge. I'm not, I'm not a pretty picture, which is why I don't do it often. And I've been in some verbal battles and or email battles where I begin to say things that I really shouldn't like.

00:24:20 I would probably start my thing with professor Dave talking about how his accusing astrologers of being stupid as a simple act of projection. And let's start there. Boom. You know, but, but, but, but see, I've been here before nothing good will ever come of it. And, and he'll end up making fun of me and a lightening bolt on my shirt or my middle name Merlin or something forever.

00:24:55 And I won't have the time effort, energy, or reach in order to respond to him every time he says something. So what do you do?

00:25:04 [Amanda] Right. So in general, when you have a critic or someone who is, you know, what'd you say also someone who's ridiculing you, you you've said that one of the places that you start as,

00:25:16 yeah. I don't believe in astrology either. At least

00:25:19 [Rick] I don't believe in the Astrology that you don't believe in.

00:25:23 [Amanda] I don't believe in the Astrology that you don't believe in either. Yeah. So what are some other things, what are some other go-to things that you do say when you're, when you feel like the time is right?

00:25:34 [Rick] Well, there's so many anecdotes and so many stories.

00:25:37 My, my overall go-to line, and I've been down this road on chat in, in, in, in chats, on email lists, you know, before YouTube, before Facebook, when they would just people discussing things, I've been so down this list or so down this rabbit hole. And, and I think overall, the thing that I come back to again and again,

00:26:08 is that you can't call yourself a scientist, unless you've done the research about that, which you're investigating. In other words, you don't start off without knowing anything. If you're doing research, you know, and thinking that the speed of light has been measured wrong, and you have a correction to it as a scientist, it's upon you to do the research and to read the material that other scientists have written about the speed of light.

00:26:40 And to read the Mickelson morally that determined that the speed of light is 186,000 miles per second, or whatever, and so on. So on. And if you don't do that, you're not a good scientist. That's where you start. And so my go-to line often is I understand that, you know, that you think that this is a lot of bullshit,

00:27:05 but the fact of the matter is that there is a whole universe of published research, material and research description, material that unless you read, you do not have the right to criticize it as a scientist, because you're speaking about something of which you know, nothing. And I often use John Anthony West's book the case for Astrology as a book. Don't talk to me until you've read this book.

00:27:37 Once you've read this book, I could go through specific arguments. There's probably 30 or 40 different attacks. I could take, read this book, then come back and talk to me because if you have problems with some of those arguments, then we have something to discuss. But until you know, what's been done, don't come to me just showing your ignorance because you're ignorant and being ignorant is different than being stupid.

00:28:04 Being stupid is something that you can't maybe, but you can't cure. Being ignorant is easy to cure. You read the material, you learn what you don't know. There's nothing, there's no shame in ignorance. The shame is in being ignorant and not admitting it or not wanting to do anything about it. And so I would suggest John Anthony West book, when people say,

00:28:27 well, scientific, experimentation and validation, I would bring up Michelle Gauquelin. And Michelle Gauquelin was a French statistician, who for a degree at the Sorbonne, a statistics degree, basically kind of half set out to disprove Astrology. But he wasn't really, he was, he was more interested than an absolute critic, but in France, by national law,

00:28:57 they record the time of every birth since the French revolution. And he had, I think, somewhere around 35,000 birth data, and this was before computers, they calculated these charts by hand. And originally his thesis was his hypothesis was, there is a correlation between sun sign and profession. And he found there wasn't. But as he began to dig a little deeper,

00:29:28 he discovered something that was significant enough that it's now called the Mars effect. And the Mars effect is this. If you take the charts of people who have excelled, not just anyone who's in that career, but people who have excelled at sports at any form of athletics or military, that they will tend statistically at a statistically significant rate to have Mars conjuncting,

00:30:03 their ascendant or mid-heaven or descendant, or IC, in other words, they, they tend to have Mars on the Cardinal points. Now this is done not only for Mars and athletes and soldiers, although that's the greatest, that was the first one. And it was such a hit there. I mean, hit statistical relevance is that Gauquelin spent the next 20,

00:30:29 30 years of his life doing more, doing deeper, digging on this and coming up with various keywords for the planets and discovering that politicians tended to have the moon there or actors Jupiter or whatever. I mean, there's a whole, a whole list of things, but this work, which was so astounding was picked up on by a group of scientists, largely led by an astronomer at Harvard named George Bach B.

00:31:00 Okay. And it was from that experimentation from Gauquelin's published work that they established a group under the auspices or in coordination with the magician James Randi. And this group was called psych cops or the committee for the investigation of the paranormal. I might've missed a word there. And they set out originally to disprove or to marginalize Gauquelin's work. And they did.

00:31:35 And they published a paper. Unfortunately, one of the key astronomers in that group quit because they, he basically quit because they were falsifying data. They were selecting data to prove what they already knew so that they could make fun of and marginalize Gauquelin's work in astrology. However, if a scientist says, there's no statistical validation to any of this, they haven't read Gauquelin and they haven't read maybe six or seven of his books and probably at least three or four that I can think of books written 20 years later about his research.

00:32:20 So again, it, but, but it doesn't matter cause it's not going to change that person's mind, but at least having a couple of books in your mind that you know about that you can, that you can throw out at least evens the score of a bit.

00:32:40 [Amanda] Agreed. Can You please spell the name?

00:32:44 [Rick] G.A.U.Q.U.E.L.I.N I'm going to Google it as we're talking here. So I have it, I have it right. It's easy.

00:32:45 [Amanda] You know, sometimes the, the, the defense, or at least the, it was standing up for astrology is, is more for us than it even is to convince the other person it's.

00:33:10 Sometimes I feel like it's, you know, standing up for someone that I love and defending them, it feels the same with Astrology. It's like, I don't want to just stand by as it gets bashed and it's unfairly bashed. And so I'd like to at least have a few things that I can say to defend our beloved astrology is how I think about it. Sometimes

00:33:30 [Rick] Michele Gauquelin, French psychologist and writer who attempted now this is out of Wikipedia, but notice the slant here already attempted to put Astrology on a scientific basis through his special studies of correlation between personality and cosmic influences,

00:33:54 [Amanda] Wikipedia calls, Astrology, a pseudo science like in the first sentence. Right?

00:34:01 [Rick] Well, that's right. As, as really does this guy, professor Dave explains, he says, Astrology is a pseudo science

00:34:12 [Amanda] Then why put it up on Wikipedia.

00:34:16 [Rick] Well, Maybe, but there is, there is a real issue here that makes it so that a learning person would still question whether it's Astrology is scientific or not the real question. Is it valid or not? Is it useful or not?

00:34:34 But in order for something to be scientific in the modern use of the word scientific, it means it needs to be experimentally that it needs to be. There's two things. It needs to be not verifiable, but there's a word duplicatable, but it also needs to be able to be the flip side of that. I'll think of the word as we're talking.

00:35:02 It's Not. Yeah. It, th there's, there's the negative to that where there can't be any exceptions. But the fact is that science is built upon, this is the philosophy of David Hume. The science is built upon the idea of making a hypothesis and then testing it and then testing it again and testing it again. And that if a result is valid,

00:35:30 it has to be repeatable that the repeatability factor is required. The problem is that in Astrology, there is no other Amanda Pua Walsh, you are not repeatable. There is no other Rick Merlin Levine. I am not repeatable. The moments in the heavens are not repeatable. We can take out one specific thing, like the motion of Saturn, and we can do tests statistically on the validity of that.

00:36:00 And we have, and we know that there's validity to cycles of the moon, the new moon versus the full moon. We know, you know, that that half the human population bleeds according to the lunar cycle. So you can't tell me that there's no connection between the cosmos and what's here on earth. That's just stupidity. That's just denial. The real question though,

00:36:26 is how do you put it all together? And of course, most scientists will dismiss it because, well, there's no way it could possibly work. It reminds me of, of Anton Lavoisier how many people open a sentence saying it reminds me of Lavoisier who in the 18th century, prior to the French revolution, where he was killed was made the first president of the French academy of science.

00:36:57 And one of his first duties was to deal with what was then a big concern of scientists, because people were reporting that rocks were falling from the sky. We would call them meteors. And his, one of his first official duties was to unequivocally announce. There are no such thing as rocks falling from the sky, because there are no rocks in the sky to fall.

00:37:30 Now, this is not necessarily a scientific approach to a problem. It's what we might call a syllogism, or what is circular reasoning. Many, many scientists do not believe in astrology because they know it doesn't work or that, or more importantly, they know that it's unscientific. And that whole thing is incredibly interesting because often they're making their judgment on the fact that how can you possibly take humanity and divide it up into 12 classifications?

00:38:10 And everybody be one of those or those idiot astrologers don't even know that there's 13 signs, 13 constellations in the Zodiac, not 12, or they don't even know that the constellations have changed. You know, and if you're a Gemini, you're not really a Gemini you're, you're a Taurus is just astrologers are stupid. And what they don't realize again is that they say each of those things,

00:38:36 they're showing their stupidity. No they're showing their ignorance because they may be very intelligent, but they know nothing about what they're talking. They know nothing about which they are talking about. This is an extra word there. I don't know.

00:38:51 [Amanda] We did a podcast episode on that 13th sign thing? So you can, I don't know the number. Maybe we can put that in the chat,

00:38:59 but we definitely did an episode covering that because that comes up Well. And then, you know, and of course the simple thing to explain to an astronomer, the very simplest thing is that if you think that modern astrology is based upon the constellations, then your whole understanding of astrology is wrong because it's actually based upon a dividing, a circle into 12 in order to classify or work with that dynamic energy.

00:39:27 And there can't possibly be a 13th sign because the system is built upon the idea of dividing a circle into 12 parts. The, the constellations were not there first, you know, the stars were, but when it comes to Taurus and, and Ophiucus and whatever other, we make all that stuff up in our heads, you know, in fact there aren't 12 signs up there.

00:39:51 There's 12 signs in here, and then we projected outward. And so, you know, the, their claims are, are just typically based upon upon lack of knowledge.

00:40:02 [Amanda] So Rebecca has a question. I don't know if you want to go down this path, but the question is Rick, what would your response be to an Eastern astrologer? Who names Western astrology as gaslighting?

00:40:18 [Rick] I'm not sure I understand how it would be gaslighting. I understand that they are different and maybe that person could, could say what they mean by how it is guests lighting. Well, and we've talked about this several times on the podcast too, about Eastern. I I've encountered, I don't know about all of you, but the sort of opinion that Eastern astrology is the right one.

00:40:48 And Western astrology is like the newer but less valid form of Astrology.

00:40:54 [Rick] Well, Einstein bails us out there because Einstein very clearly explains his part of his Nobel prize. Einstein very clearly explains that there are no stable points in the universe. Everything is moving. Therefore you need to pick a point of reference and, and Eastern astrology sometimes referred to as Vedic astrology,

00:41:21 because it comes from the oral religious or spiritual traditions of India. The Vedas, sometimes it's referred to as Jyotish, which is the correct name for it in, I don't know what dialect, it might be Sanskrit, but one of the Indian languages is Jyotish regardless of what you call it, that is based upon the fixed reference frame of the stars. So that is a constellational Astrology,

00:41:53 even that has a little bit of a problem I'll cycle back in just a moment, just a quick sentence, but, but what the Astrology that we modern nurse practice is actually based upon the seasons it's seasonal Astrology, the word tropical astrology is what we would use and the other Astrology sidereal or of the stars. They're just two different mapping techniques that say,

00:42:18 this is my fixed point. The problem is that if you pick the stars to be the fixed point, and you say that Aries is the first sign of the Zodiac, that every 72 years, the spring Equinox slips one degree further back because of the wobble of the earth into Pisces, and then eventually into Aquarius and eventually all the way around, over a period of about 26,000 years.

00:42:50 And so the, the, the Astrology astrologers have disconnected themselves from the seasons modern tropical or Western or seasonal astrologers, basically tie the map to the four fixed points in our cycle, around the sun, having to do with the tilt of the earth and the points at which the earth is pointing most away or most toward the north pole, that would be the winter and summer solstices.

00:43:27 And then the point at which there's equal daylight on both, you know, all over the planet, equal, dark and equal light. And that is at the equinoxes, the equal nights, those four points are the, the anchor of modern Astrology and both astrologies have use and have validity, but you can't do them both at the same time. Any more than a physicist can make a subatomic thing,

00:43:56 a particle and a wave at the same time, light travels like a wave when you measure it for a moment, becomes a particle by the same token, the difference between Eastern and Western astrology, you can't have, you can't hold both positions at the same moment. They both have validity in their own sphere. Now, I'm not sure if that answered the question or what that has to do with ghosting.

00:44:20 [Amanda] Well, Rebecca basically confirmed that she was basically putting down Western as invalid. So what you're saying is they both have validity. They're both using a different point of reference from which to map everything, but, and you can't use both at the same time, but that each one has their own. Absolutely. And the ancients knew about this slippage. They were very aware of it.

00:44:46 And so for NASA to come out and saying, astrologers are idiots because they don't even have the right sign. They're basically saying that they were the ignorant ones because they didn't realize that astrologers have known about this backward movement, this precession of the Equinox, meaning that the Equinox moves backwards. One 72nd of a degree every year, too little to notice in one's lifetime,

00:45:14 but enough to notice over generations or even over millennia. And so they don't know that astrologists not only knew it, but invented or discovered it knew it way before others did. And here's another piece, that's a problem in all this. And that is that modern scientists will take a look at like Johannes Kepler, who's called the father of modern astronomy and say,

00:45:39 well, he only did astrology, Because he got paid for, he made money doing it. And he didn't really believe in it. He just did it because that's the way he got money from emperor Rudolph. When the fact of the matter is that his Astronomical discoveries and his optical discoveries and his other, I mean was a brilliant scientist and mathematician that they were an offshoot of the thing that drove him,

00:46:07 which was the mathematics of how Astrology kind of conformed to human behavior. And it was actually Johannes Kepler, who was the first person to hypothesize that the star of Bethlehem could have been a Jupiter Saturn conjunction. Why was he the first person to hypothesize that because of his discovery of the laws of planetary motion, he was the first person to be able to use those mathematical formulas and go back 2000 years or in his time,

00:46:38 1500 years and, and calculate where those planets were. The, the problem though is many problems. The problem though, is that scientists in general have a very different view of what Astrology is compared to the knowledge that the knowledge that drives it, that many brilliant scientists have had throughout time. They, they forget that, you know, I've said this many times that,

00:47:14 you know, Hippocrates, which who is known because any practicing doctor takes the Hippocratic oath and the Hippocratic oath is actually one part of a longer that says, no person shall practice medicine without knowledge of the stars, but that's been, oh, that was just an ancient superstition. Let's just kind of drop that away. And so this is all getting a little bit off track though,

00:47:46 because what we're really coming want to come back to is this idea that we as astrologers have to live in a world that even though when I'm hanging out with you and there's, you know, 10 or 20 or 30,000 people, 50,000 on know my, my monthly YouTube feed, when there's that amount of people feeding back to you, consistency, with your perspective,

00:48:14 you forget that it's still a fringe perspective. And that apple thinks it's like equatable to farts and burps and that square who many people use for credit card acquisition. If in your application, you tell them you're an astrologer. You will not yet. You will be denied. You know, that doesn't mean that there aren't hundreds of astrologers using square. It just means that like,

00:48:43 Chani, you don't, you don't throw it in their face so that they can say go away. You know, in fact, that's one of the reasons why the largest astrological educational organization in the world, which is NCGR our nonprofit organization called the national council N C G R the national council for geo cosmic research. Where's the word Astrology,

00:49:16 [Amanda] Rick I'm like, I think I'm too proud or something. I can't go there. Like, it feels like, like denying the thing. I can't explain it, but it's so we could totally mask our thing. Our app not use the word Astrology, not use the word astrologer, really just give them exactly what they want, but I can't do it. I can't do it.

00:49:38 It just feels so wrong. And I wanted to thank this whole audience in this community. So many people have chatted in some great ideas for how we can work around it, or just, you know, screw apple. You don't need them anyways. We will be doing this no matter what, it's just, how, what avenue are we going to use?

00:49:57 But the avenue of, of just cloaking the whole thing and like eliminating astrology from our language completely just feels so off. It just, it, it feels really out of integrity, at least for Astrology Hub. I mean, come on. It's like, that's what we're doing.

00:50:15 [Rick] Yeah. Yeah. Well, look, I've been, I I've been a self defined astrologer for close to 50 years.

00:50:22 Maybe more frames that. And, and I have to say that in that amount of time, at least in the last 35 or 40 years, it's made it, it's a huge, hugely different scene. And a lot of that is because you can't easily restrain people from learning on the internet and the internet has, I mean, there's lots of reasons why things are different,

00:50:55 but the internet has taken this, this curve and it's turned it into almost a straight line up. And, you know, and there was an astrologer who passed away a few years ago, who was an absolute delight. She did the Saturday night keynote lecture at NORWAC for probably 10 years in a row. And every time she did it, she people would be laughing so hard.

00:51:26 They would be on the floor. People would have to be excused, you know, to go to the bathroom. It was like, it was like this woman was, was, was, was absolutely brilliant in her storytelling. Her name was Diana Stone and Diana Stone was just, just, just a gem. And she said, one of her lectures, I remember she says,

00:51:50 why are we trying to convince them that we're right. She goes, I used to think that we had to do everything that we can to continue to, you know, you know, to, to convince others that we are right. It's like we want to be in the mainstream. And then she said, why the mainstream is polluted. She goes,

00:52:18 she goes, here's an alternate way of dealing with this. Imagine that you're in an old Cowboys and Indian, I know this may be politically incorrect these days, but I'm going to go with it. Anyhow. Imagine you're in an old Western movie and you're, you're in the you're, you're a native American, and you're at the top of a cliff with your,

00:52:42 with your tribe, with your band. And the cavalry is kind of going through this kind of canyon rather than confronting the cavalry, the main stream. Let's just pick off the last person quietly one at a time until the only person going through the canyon is the general with no one behind him. The great metaphor, every person that you interact with on a one-to-one basis is your chance to pick off one person off the back of that route of the back of that train.

00:53:21 And, and, and in some ways that may be way more effective. Now, there are other, I mean, like any real war, there's many ways to do battle. I totally respect Rick. Tarnas not only for his, his encyclopedic books, passion of the Western mind and cosmos and psyche, but his working with Kenny and producing this 10 part documentary on,

00:53:53 in particular, the Uranus Pluto conjunction square opposition cycle. And I think that it has the potential for really altering people's perceptions about what Astrology is not the Astrology that we do on a day to day basis, because it has nothing to do with, you know, I'm, I'm a vegetarius, you're in crises or whatever, but, but it's,

00:54:21 but it's a different look. It's a different level, but it's still Astrology. I have seen all 10 episodes and it's stunning and I can't wait for it to become, it's being released. As I know, you know, on February 22nd. And you'll have more to say about that. I know over the weeks ahead to Astrology Hubbards, but it's things like that that are in fact making a difference,

00:54:49 the work of Michelle Gauquelin, even though it created a lot of anti resistance in the scientific community, it also created a lot of interest. I, I have an associate who got his master's in statistics doing statistical analysis in astrology. Now he, the fact that he's an astrologer is secondary. He's a, an academic statistician. He teaches at a college level,

00:55:29 but he used Astrology as part of his, you know, and not as part of, but as the data for his thesis. So we're seeing more and more of that. When you go to Astrology conferences, these days, you meet, whoever goes, when I, my first Astrology conference I went to was in 1975, and it was basically, you know,

00:55:54 a bunch of fellow hippies and, you know, people kind of drifting around mostly in purple robes and, you know, with crystals taped to their heads, and I'm not making fun of any of this. I'm just saying that was, that was Astrology. Now, when you go to an Astrology conference, you see people with PhDs after their names, you know,

00:56:18 you see people with PhDs in psychology, in economics and history, and you see a whole different tenor of the level of excellence when it comes to research. In fact, ISAR, the other large organization, which is the international society for astrological research has a quarterly research journal as does the organization in, in Britain, the AA, the Astrology association. So we've made huge progress.

00:56:58 The problem is that unless you know about it, you don't know about it. And astrology becomes one of those many things that people don't know about because they've been fed such a strong party line. Like we moderners are on many other things. We're not going down that rabbit hole, but when you're fed such a strong line, that this is the truth,

00:57:25 look, the bottom line is this science is built upon research and exploration. It's not built upon, this is the truth. Don't contradict my results. That's, that's the opposite. That's the total opposite of science that science is not built upon. Suppression science is built upon exploration and experimentation and is built upon the dialogue and the sharing of that data, not the shutting it off and,

00:57:59 and, and, and making it go away. So when people say trust the science, and I'm not here talking about COVID in particular, I'm talking about science. When someone says don't believe that trust the science, that's always frightening, because what they're meaning is don't question outside of what we think we already know enough said there.

00:58:23 [Amanda] And thank you for that. Yeah. That, that's, it's very true. And I think sometimes we forget with an astrology that we are, we are still in the same category of, of not of misinformation, you know, w so to speak, like, we're, we're still, we're not in the accepted narrative and we're still outside of that.

00:58:48 [Rick] And so, So 20, 25 years ago, yeah, a little bit more than that. I attended a meeting with a dozen astrologers. Laura nalbandian was there, Jeff Green was there a few other people were there, Michael and Casey, some pretty well-known astrologers. And we were brought together to consider if there could be a, a Astrology college in the United States. And at that meeting, we kind of agreed that it would take effort to make something happen because of the environment.

00:59:21 And I said, well, if we do this, the name is going to be really important because we've been kicked out of academia. I mean, I say we Astrology has largely beginning with the age of reason, which I love Rob hand calls instead of the age of enlightenment. He calls it the age of endarkenment. But, but from that period on Astrology,

00:59:48 which had been a part of the university picture had been shunted further and further outside. And I said, we need to give this, this college a name that's like a Trojan horse. And I said, for example, we could take, you know, Johannes Kepler, who is believed to be the father of astronomy of modern astronomy. And yet, because we also know that he contributed more to astrology in his lifetime than most,

01:00:16 almost anyone within a three or 400 year period around his, his life, his contributions are deep and wide into astrology, including the introduction of Quintiles, which, you know, is a part of my work and half squares and semisquare is in sesquisquares. And so on, I said, we could name this, the Kepler college of astrological arts and sciences.

01:00:44 And then what, what does the scientific community do? Because it's truth that Kepler was first and foremost, an astrologer. Although I should say that in his book, Tertius Interveniens, which is translated as third person between it's like third man in the middle. And he's describing himself kind of standing between the old beliefs and the new science that's unfolding. And he said that when scientists,

01:01:16 this is not a direct quote, but it's pretty close. He said, when scientists look back at the superstitions and blasphemies, that are contained within the body of Astrology, that I caution them, or caution us against throwing out the baby with the bath water. That's where that saying comes from. Don't throw the baby out with the bath water. It's a Kepler ism,

01:01:43 cautioning scientists, not to throw astrology out with all the other things that would like to say are just ignorant superstitions from, from, from the, from the past. And so it's, I think we're at a very significant point in history where we have the ability to regain that peer acceptance. However, my concern is, and it has been for 30 years that that some group of engineers at Caltech or MIT are going to discover these ultra ultra long waves that are not gravity waves,

01:02:28 but they seem to be somehow related to the planets and that through complex foray analysis. And so on that, we're now beginning to discover how these waves create personality, but this has nothing to do with Astrology.

01:02:43 [Amanda] I mean, as you're describing that though, wouldn't that be kind of cool on some level, because we would know that that's actually there

01:02:53 [Rick] Again, we would know, but once again, we would be disfranchised and it would be illegal to use the word Astrology when describing that phenomenon, you know, a lot of the similar stuff has happened in, or it's still happening within the world of, of what we now call alternate alternative medicine, which remember wasn't alternative until the 20th century when John D Rockefeller,

01:03:23 who was making a fortune out of petroleum realized that the manufacturing of, of medicines, which used petroleum was a huge field of interest. And it was his money, his advertising that basically took things like homeopathy and the old, more traditional net. What we now call them naturopathy and basically made them illegal. You know, you couldn't use those things because the American medical association had the single definition of what was medical,

01:03:54 what was, what was valid. And of course now we've seen again that, that through universities colleges, best year university here in Seattle, as an example, that, that this is a naturopathic college, that's winning, you know, grants from NIH against the big Eastern medical schools. And yet, even though they're playing in that field and it's gained,

01:04:22 you know, more Mo modern doctors, these days will acknowledge that it may be good to take or vitamin C or glucosamine or whatever, that, that it's still out there. You know, you're still, if you're in trouble, go to the doctor, don't go to your natural path. They don't they're, you know, they're, they, they can heal real things.

01:04:47 They're only there to, you know, kind of make you feel a little bit better. And I think that there is a similarity is where I'm going with this, between Astrology, and let's say natural apathy, including Vedic, are you Vedic medicine, including homeopathy, including herbalism, including all of these other mind, body healing mechanisms. And, and yet I think that it's important that we don't go back to sleep and not,

01:05:17 we're not there. We have not, we have not won the battle, or let me say this way, we've won some significant battles, but we haven't won the war.

01:05:27 [Amanda] So Rick, after all of this, are you going to respond to professor Dave? I'm so curious enough, you're going to do it, Make sure that you let us know and you give us the link so that we can check it out and cheer you on.

01:05:43 If anything, it will be fun for us to watch it. I mean, at the end of the day, I'm grateful that all of you are here, that we have these communities, these Astrology communities, where we can speak the language together. We don't need all of them. We can just have our conversation here when, when they want to start coming in.

01:05:59 Of course the door is always open, but it's really interesting to see that we're, we're I was thinking we were, that Astrology was becoming much more normalized. And I think it, it has, especially for someone like you who were watching it for 50 years, you're like, yes, it has.

01:06:15 [Rick] No, but it has, but it has even in the wider public,

01:06:18 again, one of the most. But before I say what I can say, I just want to give a quick shout out to Adrian, who is posted quantum love coach. Hi, Rick and Amanda and blessings from Uber Bali, where I wish I was right now. And I met injury and in Bali a couple of years ago. So just a wave out to the where,

01:06:43 where are we? I got sidetracked.

01:06:46 [Amanda] Oh, just in terms of normalization. And you've been doing this for 50 years, 50 years. And it has become more normal.

01:06:54 [Rick] Yeah. So, so it, it has become more normal and it is certainly way more normalized in the younger, in, in the maybe young guest or younger generations of which I like to think myself a part of,

01:07:10 but, but there is a tremendous book that actually was written by a professor at Harvard college. One of Rick Tarnas' important influences, and one of Rick's teachers when Rick was studying classics at Harvard in the late sixties, early seventies, and this guys wrote a book, his name is Thomas Quhn, . I believe it is. And as we're talking,

01:07:41 I'm doing a quick search here. So Thomas Quhn wrote a book called I S popped out of my mind, the theory of scientific revolution, say something for a second. I say something.

01:07:58 [Amanda] Well, I just wanted to point you all back to the other books that Rick has recommended today, because there's been a lot of great resources that you can turn to,

01:08:13 especially this Jonathan Anthony West, a case for Astrology. So pointing people to that as the first place to start as, like, if you haven't read that yet, then let's, let's wait to have this conversation until you've read that book. And then tell me what you think I'll go,

01:08:28 [Rick] Or Michelle Gauquelin? I mean, there are many other books.

01:08:31 Do those come to mind by the way I w I was right. I didn't trust my memory, but Thomas Quhn wrote a book called the structure of scientific revolutions. It's actually now available in its 50th anniversary edition. It's available on Kindle for only 11 bucks and 50 cents. But what Thomas Quhn wrote about was the idea that we're taught that science is built upon dialogue between people,

01:09:05 until someone comes to a major breakthrough. And then everyone adapts to that major breakthrough does research on it until there's another breakthrough and so on, and what he says, and he uses what we call the Copernican revolution as, as the one of the, but as the main idea that feeds this theory. And that is that when a scientist comes up with a new idea,

01:09:32 it is not accepted. What happens is the old guard eventually dies. Oh, wow. It's a very different, very different view. And so like when it comes to the Copernican revolution, for those of you who don't know, it was Copernicus who was a generation before Kepler who wrote the book that clue mathematically and clearly showed that the earth could not be the center of our solar system,

01:10:05 that it was in fact, the sun, and this of course was considered heresy Galileo, read the book and, and spent Saturn cycle 30 years under house arrest. Because, because he was not adhering to the churches doctrine that the earth is the center and everything goes around it. And of course it is a legend that when he recanted publicly and was taken off house arrest that after he recanted under his breath,

01:10:37 he said, but it does move. Question, said it in Latin, but, but it took several generations before people began to realize that the earth was not the center, that the sun was the center. It took 500 years for the church to reverse their excommunication of Copernicus of Galileo to there's a word where they forgive. I don't know, but there's a word that they,

01:11:11 that they absolved Galileo of this of this horrific crime. 500 years. And so the idea that someone comes up with something that's useful or valid or real, and it then gets accepted as just not how it works. And of course, Rick Tarnas and many of us, many, many people understand that we are in the midst of a paradigm change.

01:11:41 That word used that way comes from the structure of scientific revolutions, but that we are in the midst of a paradigm change. That is a big ger than the one that was changing from the pre Copernican earth is the center to the post Kopernik and the sun is the center. And so we go through these changes and they do not happen just because someone has good information.

01:12:10 They happen because the power holders of the old system die power.

01:12:15 [Amanda] Wow. Fascinating. And it's really interesting to think about how much when our concept of reality is threatened, how much we will hold on to something. Even if it's obviously it's been, it's evolving and it needs to be upgraded, but we'll hold on so tight because it's too threatening to the,

01:12:39 our version of reality.

01:12:40 [Rick] Discerning light wrote the AMA was formed to stamp out homeopathy. And that's exactly correct. It was funded by John D Rockefeller and there were entire medical colleges that were, I mean, it, at the turn of the 19th century, if you were a medical doctor, it was, it was just as likely, I don't know what the actual percentage was,

01:13:05 but to be a homeopathic physician was not considered to be something abnormal. It was just, it was part of medicine.

01:13:13 [Amanda] Yeah. Well, I would love to hear from all of you. So Rick has given us some great things to either say or not say when you're faced with an astrology critic, when you're feeling ridiculed for your, your exploration of astrology.

01:13:28 And I'd also love to hear from all of you, if you have any things that you've said that you find are particularly helpful, or at least they make you feel better and maybe you're it doesn't accomplish the goal of convincing anyone of anything, which we don't need to do anyways. But anything that

01:13:46 [Rick] you To pick that last person line off when We're doing that.

01:13:49 [Amanda] I mean, that's what, that's what we're doing. I think we've both experienced growth in our own communities and we've seen like more and more people come into the fold and go, oh, Hey, this is interesting. They're having interesting conversations here. Maybe I can hang out and learn something. So I think we're doing that already for sure. And then again,

01:14:05 I'd love to hear from all of you in terms of things that you've said that, that work, that, you know, least open up a dialogue or whether or not you just don't even bother and just save your energy.

01:14:15 [Rick] I think discerning light again and said, does it matter what edition of the Thomas Quhn book? I don't think so. I think they're just different additions.

01:14:23 There might be some minor rewriter is the 50th anniversary one sounds cool. And inexpensive compared to the original copies. I don't know.

01:14:32 [Amanda] I love what Susan says. I actually would really like to contact the people at apple and let them know what I think about their decision, Susan. I think that'd be a great idea. I have a feeling it's some,

01:14:44 like, I don't even know some person sitting in their desk at their desk in Silicon valley, just, you know, things come through and they're like, oh yeah, this is garbage.

01:14:57 [Rick] Hey, look, this whole thing that I went through with Instagram recently, there's a part of me that can't escape. The notion that if my site was on w where to find the right pharmacy for your medical prescription,

01:15:13 that I would have been back up in a moment. But my site, you know, I mean the name of the site. And again, if you haven't been there, go there and follow me. The name of the site is Rick Levine astrologer. So I can't say well, but it's not about astrology and I can't help, but believe that that's part of why I've bumped into this just dead wall of silence.

01:15:37 It just seems like that's, that's a part of the problem for me. I think so. I think so, too. All right.

01:15:43 [Amanda] Well, Rick, thank you so much for sharing your insights and your ideas and your wisdom and your humor. It's been super fun and thanks all of you for hanging out and being here as part of our cosmic connection community.

01:15:57 [Rick] And I hope to see a lot of you in LA, February, February 4th, through the seventh, check it out. Conscious life expo, The conscious life, Conscious life expo.com. Yeah. Great. Okay.

01:16:09 [Amanda] So check Rick out, go to his Instagram. Let's help him build that back up. And then if you don't receive our cosmic insider yet our weekly newsletter,

01:16:19 that gives you the summary of the different podcast episodes we've done. Plus some insights on the actual Astrology of the week. Check that out as well. That's totally free AstrologyHub.com/Insider. We have some exciting things coming up with Rick for the rest of the year. So you'll be learning about more about that soon. And I just want to thank you all for being here.

01:16:41 Thank you for being a part of our community and thank you for making Astrology a part of your life. Even if that makes us a little fringy. I think it's great. I, I like, I like being on the fringe with all of you. So thank you for being here and Rick, thanks as always. All right, take care. Everybody.

01:16:57 We'll see you in a couple of weeks for our not next week, but the week after for our February forecast with Rick here on the cosmic connection. Hey, take care. This podcast is presented by Astrology Hub. You can learn more and find all of our shows at Astrology Hub dot com slash podcast. If you enjoyed this episode, please rate review and hit subscribe on your favorite podcast platform.

01:17:24 So you can stay up to date on the latest episodes and help more people find the wisdom of astrology. Thank you for taking the time to do this now. Thank you for being a part of our community and for making astrology a part of your life. Hi, again, it's your weekly horoscope columnist. Christopher, Renstrom back to share with you some pretty exciting news.

01:17:52 You will soon have a chance to study with me in my upcoming course. The cosmic calendar produced here at Astrology Hub. The cosmic calendar is designed to teach you how to turn your birth chart into a personal calendar. One that's uniquely aligned to your natural flow and personal seasons. You'll be able to look at the year ahead and know exactly how to plan your life.

01:18:16 Whether you're looking to launch a business, dive back into the dating pool, or finally get around to writing that book. You said, you'd get around to writing one day. The cosmic calendar will help you to identify the best times of year to pursue your dreams. So if you want to be the first to know more about the cosmic calendar than sign up for the weightless now at Astrology Hub dot com slash cosmic waitlist again,

01:18:41 that's Astrology Hub dot com slash cosmic waitlist. I am so looking forward to seeing you there.