Are the Planets Gods? w/ Christopher Renstrom

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Christopher Renstrom and Amanda Walsh talk about how the planets became so important in astrology.

On this episode, You’ll learn…
๐ŸŒ’ About the history of astrology and how the study of planets has evolved over time.
๐ŸŒ” About the debate surrounding the inclusion of newer celestial bodies in astrology, and the importance of understanding the historical context of astrological interpretations.
๐ŸŒ–About astrology as a language and how it can be used to synthesize and interpret the stories of individual charts and planetary movements in the sky.

๐Ÿช Find your personal celestial guide with the Ruling Planets for Unruly Times course. Learn how your ruling planet influences life, personality, challenges and opportunities! ๐Ÿ”ฎ

[00:00:00] Welcome to the Astrology Hub Podcast. I’m Amanda Pool Walsh, founder of Astrology Hub and your host For our flagship show, we explore the many ways astrology can support you and your relationships, career, health, and personal growth. Thanks for tuning in.

[00:00:24] hello everybody. It’s so great to be here with you live. If you’re tuning into the recording, don’t worry. You’re not missing anything here today that won’t be relevant for you later, but for those of you who are here live, it’s great to be here with you. Today we’re going to be exploring one of those fundamental questions that often those of us who are immersed in astrology, we take it for granted.

[00:00:46] So where do the planets get their meaning? Why are the planets even important? Like how did that even happen? And uh, even exploring things like why do some people consider the planet’s gods and why have these like amazing. You know, temples and things been created for the planet and or is that complete blasphemy?

[00:01:11] So we’re going to be exploring lots of these topics with one of our favorite astrologers historians, um, someone who just brings so much depth and richness to our study of astrology. And that is, of course, the wonderful and amazing Christopher Renstrom. And so, again, if you’re new to our channel, a warm welcome to you.

[00:01:31] You have just joined a vibrant, worldwide astrological conversation that happens here every single week, lots of episodes, every week, and to all of our dedicated subscribers who tune in regularly, who leave comments, who share your episodes with your friends and family. We are incredibly grateful for you.

[00:01:48] You help us get our work out to more and more people, so thank you for being such an amazing part of our community. Alright, so Christopher? Yes. I’m getting to you in just also teaching a course that we are launching tomorrow. It’s a three week course. It is. You can consider it your foundational course.

[00:02:09] In the planet. If you want to understand the planets on a whole new level, go super, super deep into their meaning, the why of what they mean and why they mean it. Um, you know, the story and mythology and all those things behind it, and learn from a masterful teacher. This is gonna be the class for you. You can consider it your foundational course in.

[00:02:33] Planet. So it’s a complete deep dive on that topic. But then also you’ll get to learn about your ruling planet, how this shows up in the chart, how to interpret it in the chart, um, how to actually use the information about your ruling planet. In your life so that you can use that ruling planet as an advocate, an ally, an ally, a cheerleader, a steward, a den.

[00:02:58] Mom, I love all the, the terms you use for it, Christopher. It’s so cute. But, um, that’s what you’re gonna be doing in this course. You can go to astrology planet. No ruling planets, astrology planet, and, um, learn more about that today and join us for class starting tomorrow. And even if you catch this later, this course will still be available to you.

[00:03:21] So if you’re interested in diving really deep into the planet, you can check it out. All right, Christopher, welcome. So great to have you here. Thank you for having me back. I, I, I love it. I always look forward to it. It’s always such a joy and a pleasure and a delight. Ah, and a delight. I love that word delight.

[00:03:37] Isn’t it? I mean, it’s such a good word. Yes. Okay. Let’s start with that big picture question. Yeah. Why do the planets have the meanings they have? Where does that even come from? Right. Uh, basically it comes from, uh, Sumeria, Mesopotamia and ultimately Babylon. That’s where astrology really has its roots here in the west.

[00:04:06] And, um, it comes from this idea that the planets were riding out the will of the gods in the heavens. Okay? And so, uh, when, when the high priests went out on the cigarettes to examine the heavens to forecast the future, you know, like, uh, weatherman forecasting tomorrow’s weather, um, they would look to the planets moving in front of the, uh, constellations.

[00:04:35] In order to divine or interpret their meanings. And so each of the planets were associated with a deity. And you can almost think of it as a moving alphabet. You know, there was going to be a vowel, there was going to be a consonant. Um, and so characters were assigned to each one of these planets, and they were named after Gods.

[00:04:59] But at no point were they regarded. As the gods. Okay? They, they weren’t seen as the physical, um, embodiment of the God. You know, like you look up in heaven, you see the planet Venus, and so there’s a goddess and you worship it. It wasn’t like that. It was more that the gods were, uh, using the planets to spell out, uh, predictions or prophecies for these, uh, high priests to catalog and to interpret.

[00:05:30] And so in the beginning, uh, you basically had, uh, the planet’s, um, let’s go like this. Uh, the Babylonian version of Jupiter was Marduke. Okay? Who actually is the one who sets into motion? Um, he, he’s the one who arranges the stars into constellations, and he’s also the one who sets the fixed stars and the telling, the organizing of the year and the 12 months according to the fixed stars, that’s Marduke.

[00:06:00] And he was given the planet Jupiter that was associated with him. Uh, then there was the moon, which was a god, not a goddess, uh, na or sin. And uh, the moon was often interpreted. Uh, the, the nana or sin was said to be, uh, the God of fertility and waters, but also associated with cattle, uh, because of the horned moon, uh, in the crescent moon or in the waxing moon in the way that it would sort of sit on, on, in, in the sky or on the horizon.

[00:06:31] So that was also the association with, um, with, with cattle. And you see that later on in Egyptian lore, uh, with the bowl and the, and the moon being framed between, its, its horns. Uh, then there was, uh, UTU or Shama, and he was the sun God. And, uh, because he was a sun God and was out in daylight, he could see everywhere.

[00:06:53] And so he was a, he was an all seeing God, uh, because the sun saw everywhere on, on the earth when, when, when it was out in the day. And he was associated with it. With being a di divine judge and the protector of Travelers, uh, Then there was Ishtar, uh, her father was, uh, Nana or Sin and Ishtar was the goddess of love, beauty, war, and fertility, and she was associated with Venus.

[00:07:24] Then there was, the Saturn figure is interesting. It’s nuta. And he was Lord of the barley associated with farming and healing, curing humans of sickness and releasing them from the power of demons, which is such a fascinating thing because, you know, Saturn takes on a more demonic, uh, reputation or being associated to, uh, difficulties and travails.

[00:07:46] But, but here, um, what gets passed down through the generations and interpreting Saturn was. His association with agriculture and with farming. And so he’s nea. Uh, then there’s Nabu, who is the patron. He’s Mercury and he was the patron God of literacy, the rational arts, scribes and wisdom. And finally there was Neal, whom we know as Mars, who is the God of war, death, and disease.

[00:08:13] So these are kind of the. Early. These are, these are, these are the first versions and, and, and it’s how they appeared. These were the characters as they appeared in the skies and offered themselves to interpretation and divination. Okay, so here’s my question. Yeah. You’re saying the planets were regarded.

[00:08:35] As almost like facilitated facilitators of God’s will. So like, here’s God. It’s funny, of course, as a Capricorn articulative, like, here’s God, the c e o, here’s the planets, the all the directors and the vice presidents or whatever of the company. So the, the, the CEO or God is giving the big vision and then the planets are helping to facilitate that will, okay, here’s my question, Christopher.

[00:09:00] Yeah. It sounds so like fanciful. It sounds so superstitious. It sounds so like, it just doesn’t sound valid. It sounds like these like stories, like how are we to place validity in these ideas? Well, first of all, we have to remember we’re looking at it from a 21st century lens. So it sounds fanciful or silly or something like that.

[00:09:30] But if you can imagine almost like a movable type, you know, imagine like on your screen, you know, um, words being typed out on a screen. That’s basically how they were looking at the nighttime sky. Oh, you know, the, the planets were changing their direction and so they were typing out messages. To be understood now.

[00:09:50] Now we do it in terms of like a text. You know, we look at a phone and we’re like, oh, you know, I don’t work with vowels. I just do consonants because I’m texting and maybe I’m gonna throw out an emoji. Okay, well take that idea and travel back to Mesopotamia. Okay? Think of the way that we combine letters and words and emojis.

[00:10:12] Some people just. Text away in emojis. Okay, this, this isn’t so fanciful when you take that idea and you put it in the nighttime sky. So this is actually the universe communicating to them. Okay, and just as with an alphabet, we need A for A and for B, and for C and D for D, we need these words and we need to put the, arrange them to make.

[00:10:40] We need these letters and we need to arrange them to make words and ultimately texts the same exact thing was going on with the sky. They looked out on the sky and were seeing what was being communicated to them and what was being communicated to them was. Was there kingdom going to go to war? Was it going to fall?

[00:11:00] Was there going to be a plague? Uh, were we gonna have a lot of babies this year? Um, were we, uh, going into a famine? I mean, these were things that were of great importance to them. And so they looked to the heavens to get that information. Can you tell us the, the meaning of the word astrology, like broken down?

[00:11:24] Because as you’re speaking it’s, it’s like, okay, so they were reading the sky and the stars and the movement of the planet as an actual alphabet, as a language that was speaking to them. And skill astrologers are doing that today. I mean, that, that is basically what the craft of astrology is. Well, yeah.

[00:11:43] And, and this is its origin. It starts in, um, Sumer really. Becomes collected in Babylon, which is modern day Iraq, by the way. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Um, and yeah, uh, astrology is the study of the stars, the knowledge of the stars. And when you think, when you think in terms of nature, okay, you’ve got like, okay, you’ve got like a city and you’ve got walls or a big deal, you know, and you’ve got cattle and maybe you’re working on gardens and things like that.

[00:12:10] You know, I’m, I’m doing, I don’t know, like a sort of a, a, a invocation of Babylon type of, Thing. Um, and you have your good days and your bad days and your dust storms, and you know it’s a great crop this year and next year. Maybe it sucks. When you look up into the heavens, you saw consistency. The sun rose and it set the moon, went through its phases.

[00:12:34] Mars might appear next to Jupiter and then pass Jupiter. Well, what does that mean? I mean, this is before television. This is before social media. Okay. You’re looking at the sky a lot at night. Okay. Because you don’t have like Netflix to stream during the day. Okay? So, so you’re looking at this and so this relationship to the nighttime sky, which was not random.

[00:12:57] Okay. These planets appeared like clockwork. And remember, this is before clocks. Okay. These planets appeared and they would descend and over the horizon, maybe we might not see them for a while, and then they would reascend again. And so over a period of time as their movements were noted and ideas of what they were trying to communicate was noted, it was collected in in libraries.

[00:13:23] You know, um, we still have, uh, uh, the uniform tablets where they’re written. Uh, this is actually where astronomy comes from because these high priests in Babylon were the ones who really, uh, measured the orbit of Venus through Itali Rising or of Mercury, and, and it goes on to Mars and, and Jupiter. And Saturn.

[00:13:44] Okay. It all starts. Here. So this becomes like their Bible. This becomes their book of knowledge. This becomes their resource text where they could go back and say, oh, we’re looking at a Jupiter, uh, Venus conjunction. Tonight. Last time we had one was, I don’t know, lifting uniform was X amount of years ago.

[00:14:08] You know? But they could go and look at that and they would have a record of when that conjunction had taken place before and what had happened. And so they would sort of say, maybe we can expect the same thing to happen this time around. So is it a misconception that. They saw multiple gods. Is it a misconception of, of the idea that you brought up in the beginning that it’s that the planets were messengers of the gods of of God?

[00:14:36] They weren’t Gods necessarily themself or, or is it Both The planets were not. The gods themselves. But there were gods. Okay. You, you had, um, you had on, uh, I’m talking about Babylon, Mesopotamia you had on who was the God of the sky. I mean, there’s a, in fact, there’s a fabulous myth in which on and key.

[00:15:00] Honest, sky and Key are making love to each other, and they are interrupted by en. They give birth to en Leo, who’s the God of the atmosphere, who separates earth from space, and they’re interrupted by him and so on, takes the sky and moves up to the heavens. And key is taken by unle down into earth where they create the underworld, the ocean, and the earth.

[00:15:24] And they sort of set it apart from. The sky. Now, anyone who’s heard us talk before about Uranus and Gaia, okay, that’s centuries later. We’ve got Greece. Uranus and Gaia will recognize immediately, uh, the marriage of heaven and earth and its separation in the beginning of mortality. But this is, Centuries before that’s going to show up.

[00:15:46] And so this is actually how astrology is transmitted. You know, it’s astrology was transmitted first through the planets, the lore of the planets. Okay? And then there are placements and then it’s passed down. Not being called astrology, but these myths, these ideas are passed down and then they’re picked up by other religions in the Middle Eastern, uh, region that then goes out to Greece and to Persia.

[00:16:14] How has understanding the history and the mythology impacted your practice of astrology? Like how do you feel that that makes you a better astrologer? It’s, um, you know, how would a Bible impact the speech of a priest? You know, it’s, it’s, it’s, it’s the, it’s the source text, you know, because these, these stories, the dissent of AANA down into the realm of AKA down into the realm of the underworld, These, you know, these, these have been passed down through the generations.

[00:16:49] And so these attributes, these associations with the planets, you know, like if a, uh, uh, a Babylonian said, okay, that’s, uh, Venus, that, uh, or, or that’s the planet that we would call Venus. Well, that’s. Ishtar and she’s associated to love and fertility and she’s an evening star tonight, so that’s a good sign.

[00:17:10] Oh, no, Ishtar, she has risen as a morning star. That’s a sign of war. That’s not a good sign. Mm-hmm. That could discord. Okay, so, so there were these. Associations with the planet that then were associated to the deity. The deity spoke through the planet to the people below, and this was carried down through, um, the, this, this, the story of Iana, uh, the character of Nabu, uh, the, hmm, watch out for Ural.

[00:17:40] I mean, that was always, Carried down. And then as different mythologies and religions interacted with astrology, they were essentially repackaged. Not really reinterpreted, but rein repackaged by every civilization that found it. And, and, and so it’s really about a transmitting. You have to almost think of this information as being layered.

[00:18:03] You know how in Rome they can be like, oh, we were building a hotel, you know, cafe DeLuca or something like that. And, and we were, you know, digging down around or whatever, and we found, oh my goodness, a Roman mosaic. Okay. I mean, it happens in Europe all the time. They’re like in, in England, they’ll be like, oh, we’re building the shopping center and oh, there’s a Tian, you know, manor house floor underneath here.

[00:18:24] Well, that’s astrology. The, you know, the, the lore of the planets has been built over. Over the centuries, it still is coming from a source, but it was refashioned or repackaged or seen in a different way for every civilization that discovered it and every civilization that played with it. Hmm. It’s so funny, I was in the car with my daughters going, driving them to school and they were talking about their favorite subjects and they said, Both of them were just like, no, I don’t like history.

[00:18:58] It’s just, it’s just boring. But I do like Greek mythology. Greek mythology is cool. You know, both of them were liking the stories of the mythology, but history of different countries and whatever they just thought was boring. Well, what do you say to people who feel like it’s overwhelming? I mean, to me, what sometimes I, when I’m learning about the history and the mythology, you know, it seems.

[00:19:20] It seems really hard to like keep it all straight into the names and the stories and the, how do you help to simplify that and make it accessible for people? I would go in a slightly different direction and I would talk about the telling of it. Hmm. Telling of the story. Uh uh, uh uh, mythology. Basically is an allegory.

[00:19:47] You know, there have been debates for centuries about whether the Greeks believed in the myths or not. Well, the Greeks had a pantheon of gods and goddesses, absolutely. But the myths weren’t, you know, gospel truth, you know, to come up with a Catholic, you know, they weren’t a parable or anything like that.

[00:20:04] They were, the stories of the stories are more often than not, the misadventures of, of the gods and the goddesses, and that right away is what makes them so identifiable. You know, they’re not, uh, the, the gods and goddesses, the stories of Greek mythology aren’t sterile like a date. And they’re not, um, and, and they’re not so virtuous that you can’t relate to them.

[00:20:26] You could relate to jealousy, you know, you can be like, you know, oh my God, that person’s got a face that could turn in one to stone. You know, I mean, the images are so accessible and that’s what makes the stories alive. So it’s really. With, with mythology, like with the Bible, you know, you can tell the story, but how you tell the story is how you.

[00:20:50] Are relating to that story and that’s how these stories were passed down. They weren’t collected in books. We think, you know, everything was collected in books. No, it was just like, oh, you think that was hysterical? Well, you have to hear about that time when Demeter accidentally ate the shoulder bone of this guy.

[00:21:06] Okay, so, so, so you tell the story and when you tell the story, you’re gonna tell the parts that you relate to. Like, oh, that, that’s a part that I thought was funnier. That’s a part that I thought was really, really sad. Or this is the part of the story that you really need to hear, cuz it’s really, really important.

[00:21:22] Mm-hmm. So it’s more like, take the story on, you know, the story is coming from a wellspring. Take the story on and tell it from your life because you’re adding your life, you know, to the, uh, pile of herms or the, the pile of stones. You know, you’re adding your life to the pile of stones that recounts that story.

[00:21:42] Oh gosh. You are so good at that. You’re masterful and it’s just so fun to watch you in action while you do it. Okay. I have a, another question. It’s a little, might feel like a divergence, but Sure. It’s all part of this planetary conversation. Yes. So there are astrologers or types of astrology that only use the seven planets.

[00:22:03] Mm-hmm. And then there’s ones that use. Asteroids and, you know, uh, the, the new newer discovered mm-hmm. Planet. Mm-hmm. Like Pluto and Uranus and Neptune. Right. What is this distinction and why, why is that distinction made and what do you think about it? Like, what’s your personal opinion about astrology that focuses only on the seven visible planets versus astrology that focuses on a bigger depth of.

[00:22:34] Placements. Sure. Well, your question also holds the answer in it. Um, there were the seven visible planets, and so they were the set cast of characters. You know, uh, uh, if you watch a favorite TV show, you’re looking forward to your set cast of characters, you know? Or if you’re listening to a myth that’s like, okay, when does this show up?

[00:22:53] And what’s Venus up to? And is, you know, Mar’s gonna be the spoiler, you know, type of thing. You’ve got this set of characters when the modern planets were discovered. And they were called the modern planets. It’s Uranus, Neptune, and Pluto. Uh, when they were discovered in the modern age, which is why they’re also called modern planets, they were not discovered visibly.

[00:23:15] Okay. Uh, they weren’t like, oh, there’s a new planet up there. Let’s write it on day. You know, they weren’t discovered, you know, using site. Um, they were discovered through the advance of our sciences. Uh, a couple of them were discovered through guesswork. Um, and, and then it was backed up, uh, through, through observation and going through files, um, uh, uh, records kept by telescopes and things like this.

[00:23:41] Um, The, the first modern planet, of course, was Uranus. And so Uranus we know is the planet of revolution and change. Well, it upset the order of the original seven planets, um, just as at the time of its discovery, uh, which is, um, in, uh, 1781. That’s right. At the midpoint between the American Warfare independence and the French Revolution, it’s the height of the Enlightenment.

[00:24:06] And so that’s a time that was associated to Revelation and revolution, which are the two ideas that are associated to Uranus. Okay? Now for some more traditional astrologers, they’re like, I’m just sticking with the original seven. You know, um, uh, star Wars is Luke, uh, princess Leia, uh, obiwan Combi, Han Solo and Darth Vader.

[00:24:29] I’m not interested in sits or so-and-so, or, or, or Mando. Um, star Wars is just the basic cast. Okay. So, so that’s that. Okay. And then, You know, it’s the Star Wars franchise continued. There’s, uh, Yoda, there’s, uh, Manda, well Yoda is in the first group, but there’s Mandalorian and then there’s other characters who come up and they’re kind of like the moderns.

[00:24:52] Okay, so for tradit, For traditionalists. It’s like, oh, modern planet come nowhere near my pantheon, you know? And the moderns are like, you know, let’s rock and roll and let’s like add some stories to, you know, this, this pantheon and things like that. And so they ta they took on characters that were actually kind of hard.

[00:25:14] To interpret astrologers, were then faced with a creative project, which is how do you interpret a planet that doesn’t have 2300 years offor, you know, tablets to stand behind it? How do you interpret it? Uranus, for instance, it was discovered in 1781, Uranus doesn’t really. Enter the astrological pantheon as a character.

[00:25:39] You know, like I was talking about the Mesopotamians with the character planets are each associated a character. Uranus doesn’t really enter the as astrological pantheon as a character for a hundred years. All right, so there was a good a hundred years of. What do we do with Uranus? Okay. Uh, Neptune has been applied much faster.

[00:25:59] It’s discovered in 1846, and then, uh, Pluto’s the baby, uh, you know, Pluto’s 1930. It’s not even a hundred years old yet. So, so the, the creative problem that beset astrologers is. What do I turn to to begin interpreting this planet? Do I turn to mythology? Do I turn to archetype? You know, because Uranus is a character in mythology, as is Neptune and, and Pluto.

[00:26:30] Um, do I look at the time that it was discovered? And does that inform me as to the character of the planet? What was going on when Uranus was discovered? As I just said, it’s the midpoint between the American warfare independence and the French Revolution. It’s extraordinarily volatile time. Uh, it’s it’s seminal, uh, period of time in, in, in Western history.

[00:26:50] Um, so, so that’s what they look at as well. Recently we’ve added. Asteroids and dwarf planets and things like that. Um, and again, people would be like, well, let’s turn to mythology and, and, and, and, and legends and things like that. And while we’re at it, let’s not just, you know, um, limit ourselves to grease and things, but my.

[00:27:14] Hesitation with that is, and I’m not saying this because I’m a stoic Capricorn, or maybe I am saying it because I’m a stogy cap Capricorn, but it was a hundred years that went into Uranus before Uranus joined the group. You know, nowadays, sometimes it’s kind of like, oh, it’s this planet and like, you know, Three weeks later, it’s showing up in, in horoscopes, and I’m divided about that.

[00:27:37] Part of me is like, yeah, let’s experiment with it. That’s the only way you get to, you know, throw it in a chart and see if it says anything. That’s the only way you get to experiment with it. And then the other part of me is like, are we just associating random meanings? You know, it’s, it’s gotta have a, you know, it’s gotta have a little thing called history, you know, sort of, it’s, it’s fascinating and it, it almost becomes a little bit of.

[00:28:00] Like an ethical debate in some ways. One question I have is, I mean, first of all, Theoretically we may be able to cr to understand the meanings faster because of technology, because we have huge databases of charts and we can actually run correlations and do statistical analysis that wasn’t available before.

[00:28:22] So that’s one possibility. I’m not convinced that every single one of these newer things that we’re interpreting has rigorous. Research applied to it at this point. Right. But that’s one possibility. Another question I have is, why do we assume that there is an impact? So with the, like you were saying with the seven visible planets, there’s.

[00:28:46] Lot, many, many years of correlation happening. Mm-hmm. And that being passed down and, and the reading of that alphabet really well documented, right? Mm-hmm. And then taught to like next generations and things like that. Right. Why when Uranus, Neptune, and, and Pluto, when they were discovered, Why did we assume that they have any meaning or any sort of impact on life on earth, which would be the answer of the traditional astrologers.

[00:29:20] They, they would say, yeah, why are we assuming this? You know? And they said, we shouldn’t and we can’t. Uh, yes. You know, they, they don’t belong, you know, type of thing. Right. And that would, that would be their answer to it. Other traditional astrologers work with them as wild cards, you know. And then I think the other thing that they sort of upset was the system of the planetary dignity.

[00:29:42] You know, they don’t really sort of fit into that, you know, in the way and, and it’s like, You know, this is the way Thanksgiving is always done. So what are we doing with a tofu, Turkey? You know, what are you doing to my astrology? You get off my horoscope. Yes, yes. Of get off my lawn. It’s get off my horoscope.

[00:30:07] What are you doing to my astrology? You know? But, but then I also, it’s like, well, why should it? Be limited to the seven planets. If, I mean, listen, if we’re gonna be like, Mesopotamia was the dawn of astrology as well. It was ab Babylon. Well, they were taking in comets, flocks of birds, uh, the aura of the moon, a cloud.

[00:30:30] Okay. They were taking in for their divination, they were taking in things a lot more random than dwarf planets and asteroids. Okay. Wow. Okay. What it speaks to ultimately, Amanda is allegory, is reading a symbolic language, you know? Um, and that’s what the story of the planets are. I mean, and allegory is a story of poem, a picture that can be interpreted to reveal a hidden meaning, okay?

[00:31:01] Typically a moral or a purpose to it. And so that’s always been what’s been kind of like projected onto the planets with the expectation that something was going to come back, which would talk to me. You know, which would talk to me and, and how I’m living my life and what to expect or how am I realizing myself as a person, you know?

[00:31:25] So allegory is really the thing that goes back centuries. It’s as old as Babylon and it’s as modern as your emoji, you know, is is the idea of the allegory. So we’re really talking about imagination. And we’re really talking about how that affects the minds, the souls, and the genius. I mean, imagination gets geniuses to visualize a e equals mc squared.

[00:31:52] And imagination can also lead one to be delusional then. And so if you’re kind of like thinking, oh, imagination is the thing that allows me to envision airplanes, you know, or imagination is like, you know, someone’s haunting my every step that. Conversation that I just presented to you has been involved with the planet since the beginning.

[00:32:14] Hmm. It’s actually been involved with God since the beginning. How do I know this is a real sacred message versus, you know, some, some wannabe burning bush. Mm. I had, uh, coffee with a friend yesterday. She made me Turkish coffee, and she was, and she does it the, the traditional way and she’s, she was talking about how, you know, if you drink it correctly, then the grinds are left and they would actually d do divination based on how the coffee grinds were placed in the bottom of your cup.

[00:32:44] So, and I, and I have the thought when she said that I went well, I guess the universe is really speaking to us all the time in so many different ways. And if we’re paying attention and if we’re actually, um, aware and if we do believe that, that the universe is alive and it, it. It actually, um, is communicating, then we can actually get messages from a lot of different things.

[00:33:08] Right. And, and that’s where you’re kind of like getting into the realm of religion and, and, and whether you’re theistic, pantheistic, et cetera. But, you know, the, the beauty of the Greek myths and really their appeal is that they’re talking about living in a living universe. Okay. That, that, that you can engage a God or a deity in anywhere, you know, or, or they could be your inspiration in anywhere.

[00:33:37] Mm-hmm. When you have Christianity taking over, especially after, uh, St. Augustine, you have a fallen world. And a divine world. Mm-hmm. And they’re separate and you cannot bridge that gap, you know? So it was a very pessimistic view of the world. And, and, and later on when it mixes with Calvinism, a very dower view of the world, you know, but you know, for.

[00:34:04] Many cultures and civilizations, which celebrated a pantheon of gods. You know, this world, the, the, the, this world is the place where Gods and humankind intermingle all the time. Hmm. And so it was a much more living in this world, this planet. It was a place to, to celebrate god’s and, and life. Do you bring, which, which viewpoint do you bring into your practice of astrology?

[00:34:36] Oh, definitely that the world is a lot, uh, uh, that the world is speaking in so many different ways. And, and that’s one of the things that I really, uh, that I wanted to do in the workshop on the planets that, that I set up is like once you get into the head space of each of the planets, you can see and hear the planets talking to you in art.

[00:35:00] In a TV series, in a conversation, you know, and it’s not just like, oh, looking up in the sky to see the transit. Um, but you get a sense of like the planet as a world and how it contributes to this world and that they’re in continual. Conversation with us. You know, once you understand that a certain planet has a character, just like a letter has a sound, you know, and, and once you understand that, you can then craft these sentences and these texts, or you have this symbolism speak to you in a way that can become very revealing and very pertinent and very resonant with your, with your own life.

[00:35:46] Yeah, I, I’d say astrology students, one of the things that they are a, they’re a asking for the most is, how do I synthesize all this? How do I, how do I put the story together of someone’s chart? How do I take this placement and that placement and like synthesize it into co a cohesive? Message and understanding.

[00:36:06] And that’s what it sounds like you are laying the foundation for with this course. Oh yeah. Yeah. And the way that you do it is you speak the language. It’s like a language. Yes. You know, you can learn the language with like, you know, I mean, you know, just we, um, or you know, you can like conjugate ET or whatever, you know, but that’s not the.

[00:36:28] Same way as speaking Etk or you know, being etk, you know, you, you, astrology is a language. It’s meant to be spoken. Yes. If you had to, you know, we speak English. If we had to stop and be like, I don’t know, Amanda, that dangling participle, it sounds like it’s hanging out there. And what about that Jared? Oh, that object to the proposition that objects in search of a proposition.

[00:36:54] You know, I mean like if we were to. Analyze the way that we speak, we couldn’t speak. Hmm. Right. Okay. And this is where, you know, if you can get just that sense and that flow and that story and that love of interpretation, you can speak. Astrology and you’ll automatically be able to see the synthesis.

[00:37:18] What’s important, what’s not important, what’s, what’s a compelling idea, you know, as an interpreter you’re like, that’s a really compelling idea, and what’s a, ooh, that one’s in the weeds. Yes, it, I was listening to an audio book today, and you’re talking about the planets starting to speak to you and you can hear the planets and see the planets.

[00:37:38] The, the author of this book is literally Saturn speaking through this book. It’s called The Road Less Stupid, is what the book is called, and the whole time he’s talking, I’m like, This is Saturn, like, literally Saturn’s, like the structure, you need the, you know, all the, the urian things. I’m just like, oh, this is, it’s priceless, you know, to be able to hear that.

[00:38:01] And take the gifts because they each, they each have these gifts that they’re basically advocating for as like, this is the most important thing. You know, might be like enthusiasm, expansion, positively. That’s the most important thing. But the beautiful thing is when we’re aware of all of them, we get to take the, their ingredients and their messages and, and live as much as we possible possibly can.

[00:38:27] The beautiful things of all of ’em. Yeah. And, and the thing is, and what’s so wonderful is it’s not all happening at the same time. Yes. The beauty of a transit. Okay. Yes. Like that Saturn book might be, you know, that book that sounds like Saturn’s voice might be also associated to a Saturn transit right now and Totally.

[00:38:47] Oh yeah. Yeah. And this is the beautiful thing about astrology. It’s like, oh, it’s time for, it’s time for this message to, to come on through. You know? And, and, and again, this is, you know, they weren’t looking at a a, a set text sky, these ancient astrologers. They were looking at movable type that was moving across the heavens, which had consistency.

[00:39:13] Okay. That’s what gave it its ality was, and it’s not just like, oh, it’s happening in the heavens. It’s no, it had a consistency. You know? Where would we be if the sun wasn’t rising and setting? Oh no. In eclipse. That’s really frightening. Okay. Or where, or, or, or, Venus looks like she’s behaving tonight. How lovely.

[00:39:32] Oh no. Venus has come up as a morning star. Let’s, you know, be careful about our b borders of our city. So, so, so these were, you were hearing it at the time. It was meant to be heard. And that is, I mean, if you think about that extraordinary message that has continued to this day, you know, when we talk of Jung, who, rev Valorizes, astrology, Dane Reja, who takes Jung and really lays the foundation for Yung astrology, comes out of humanistic astrology and lays the foundation for y astrology in the 1980s.

[00:40:04] The living allegory, the living archetype. You know, and, and so it’s something that so speaks to us. Now it never got old, you know, it never got old and it never, you know, might’ve gone underground a little while, but, you know, if you’re building that English tavern, there might be a two-door house underneath.

[00:40:26] Well, yes. It never, it never got old and it continues to never get old and it just blows me away all the time. Uh, I love how Gemini, Brett, the astrologer, Gemini Brett calls the, the sky, the original motion picture. Yeah. Yeah. He’s like, this is what this, this was entertainment being, you know, being under that sky and when you’re speaking it’s, it’s, it must have been comforting to have something orderly in what can seem like a very chaotic reality.

[00:40:56] Yeah, well, why are we having a famine? You know, um, why, why did my harvest suck? Um, you know, um, why have I fallen in love with my beloved? You know, and, and you could, you could see the sky and it would be like, oh, you know, our word influence. Okay. Um, like the word influenza is originally an astrological term.

[00:41:22] It meant that the planet was putting a force into the air. Okay? Influenza was the idea of an illness being carried through the air. It was originally associated to plague or a pestilence. It had a Martian, a Mars quality, but the, but the planets had influences they would put into the air. In influence, you know, that, that we would experience on Earth be just like we’d experience a rainstorm or a very, very hot day.

[00:41:50] Mm-hmm. So it’s not really so wild and crazy, but the planets did it. In a routine. Mm-hmm. You did it in a set consistency. You know, like Jupiter never said like, I’m leaving this elliptic all, uh, you know, I’ll see you guys on the other side of, you know, SSA major or something like that. You know, no, Jupiter followed, you know, as did Saturn, as did Mars.

[00:42:15] You know, and um, that’s something that I think we take for granted a lot is that, you know, Brett’s right? It’s the original motion picture, but it was also the original reliable source. Mm mm Wow. Christopher, you are a delight. Thank you so much and we’re really looking forward to your three week course that you are all invited to.

[00:42:41] Yes. If you participate in this course, in where are we at May of 2023. If you participate in the live launch of this course, you will lock in the best pricing for the course. So highly encourage you if you’re interested in doing it, to do it now, even if you can’t complete everything right now. So it’s three weeks of, um, pre-recorded modules.

[00:43:05] You’ll get your lessons, I believe on Fridays, right? Or Thursdays. You’ll get your, your lessons on Thursdays. Oh, it’s Jupiter’s day. Yes. What a modules day for the lesson. Yes. Right, exactly. And then you will have some time to absorb the content. You’ll be able to ask. Questions about the content, and then we will have a live q and a with Christopher, where he will be answering questions from the students, and then also doing some live chart demonstration of the ideas.

[00:43:32] So again, you’re gonna be going deep into all seven planets plus the three modern planets. Yep. And, um, getting Christopher, getting that real depth that you need so that these planetary beings. Start speaking to you through the, you’ll start to see them in everything in movies, in music, in books, in people that you meet.

[00:43:54] Yeah. And then that will help to really create the foundation for fluency in your astrological interpretations so that you can start to tell the stories yourself. And, um, that is available to you right now. Astrology Ruling planets. Again, this astrology planets because there is an element of the course where you will also be learning about your ruling planet in your chart, both the planet and the sign that it’s in, and what that means about how to interpret your chart and how to look at the charts of your loved ones.

[00:44:30] Or if you do, you know, want to work with clients at some point you’ll be able to use that as a foundation for that as well. Anything else you wanna add to this, Christopher? Well, the, I, I love teaching this with literature, with art, with comic book strips,

[00:44:51] movie references, because it gets the image. Into, into you. You know, and so I, I’m, I’m pretty confident in saying you’re never gonna confuse the planets again. You’ll, right, you’ll know who each one, you know, you will not confuse Hamlet with her ratio, you know, or Romeo with Juliet. You’ll be very clear on.

[00:45:18] Who they are. And, and it will stay with you because the images are just so, and, and that’s why I’m so grateful, Amanda, that you, um, allowed us to pre-record it so it could really exist as a, as an evergreen source Yes. That people can go back to and just, you know, reflect and absorb again. You know? I, um, thank you so much for doing that.

[00:45:42] Our pleasure. One of the biggest feedback we got from the cosmic calendar, the, the other course that we did with you was they loved. The art, they loved the visual. They l it brought the class to life on a whole nother level, and we p we pour so much energy into it. You pour so much energy into it because it, it really does, it stays with you in a very different way when you have that visual representation and then combined with your storytelling, it’s kind of, It’s, it’s, it’s the perfect combo, I have to say.

[00:46:15] It’s, it’s amazing. So for those of you who want to check it out again, this is gonna be the time for you to lock in the best pricing that you’ll see on this course. And, um, you can join us now. You’ll have access to the course for as long as Astrology Hub lives with, which is hopefully forever. And yes, yes.

[00:46:34] So from now when they’re going through the uniform tablets? Yes, exactly. Exactly. This will be our version of creating the uniform PLA tablet. Exactly. So go check it out. Astrology planets. And like we said, the first module is released tomorrow, so you would be able to dive into class as soon as you are ready.

[00:46:55] Thanks to all of you who are here for the live broadcast of this. If you wanna be notified when we go live, At other times, make sure that you hit that subscribe button and the notification bell. And also make sure you’re on our mailing list, astrology, astrology, and that’ll make sure that you know the different things that are happening here at Astrology Hub.

[00:47:16] And you can hop on and catch broadcast like this live. Yeah. And, um, just thank you so much for making astrology a part of your life. We love that we get to have these conversations with you for you inspired by you. Here every single week. And Christopher, your best. Thank you. Thank you my dear. All right.

[00:47:35] Take care everybody. We will catch you on the next step.